sci.electronics.repair - 25 new messages in 10 topics - digest

sci.electronics.repair
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Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Luxman R117 receiver with oscillation
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/838f082c24ccbfd8?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Jan 6 2011 12:36 am
From: "N_Cook"

Tim Schwartz <tim@bristolnj.com> wrote in message
news:4D24E42C.9030502@bristolnj.com...
> On 1/4/2011 9:27 AM, N_Cook wrote:
> > Tim Schwartz<tim@bristolnj.com> wrote in message
> > news:ifv7uc$jdc$1@news.eternal-september.org...
> >> Hello and Happy New Year all,
> >>
> >> I've got a Luxman R117 receiver here that breaks into a wild
> >> oscillation when the amp is pushed. I believe that it occurs when the
> >> amp switches from the low B+ rails to the high B+ rails. Turning up
the
> >> treble control seems to make it worse, but that might be a red herring.
> >>
> >> I've changed all of the electrolytic capacitors in the tone circuit,
> >> I've tested and substituted the 4 main filter caps. I've check the
> >> suppression network on the output.I this this is some sort of
decoupling
> >> problem, but I've sent way too much time on this receiver. A friend
who
> >> worked on these when they were under warranty has looked it over as
> >> well, and we're both stumped.
> >>
> >> Anyone in the group seen anything like this on a Luxman R117?
> >>
> >> Many thanks,
> >> Tim Schwartz
> >> Bristol Electronics
> >
> >
> > Audio or ultrasonic osc?
> > What happens with reduced rails via variac?
> >
> >
> Hello Nigel,
>
> It's an ultrasonic oscillation, and a lower line voltage does not help.
>
> Thanks for your time,
> Tim
> Bristol Electronics
>

I would try some extra/changed C over preamp low voltage supplies or try
some chokes in the prea rails

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Jan 6 2011 3:59 am
From: "William Sommerwerck"

> I would try some extra/changed C over preamp low-
> voltage supplies or try some chokes in the pre rails

If these fix the problem, then the problem must be something fundamentally
wrong with the receiver's design. I suspect that isn't it.

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Jan 6 2011 4:19 am
From: "Geoffrey S. Mendelson"

William Sommerwerck wrote:
>> I would try some extra/changed C over preamp low-
>> voltage supplies or try some chokes in the pre rails
>
> If these fix the problem, then the problem must be something fundamentally
> wrong with the receiver's design. I suspect that isn't it.

At one time it was very common to use 1uF tantalum capacitors to bypass
various devices because they would go into oscilation or produce high
frequency hash without them. In the 1970's they were "required" for both
input and output sides of three terminal voltage regulators.

Over the years most of them have failed, some with a loud bang, some with no
noticable effect. It's quite possible there are a few bypass caps that worked
perfectly fine when the receiver was built that no longer do anything at all.

Geoff.

--
Geoffrey S. Mendelson N3OWJ/4X1GM
Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to misquote it.

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Jan 6 2011 4:50 am
From: "William Sommerwerck"

>>> I would try some extra/changed C over preamp low-
>>> voltage supplies or try some chokes in the pre rails

>> If these fix the problem, then the problem must be something
fundamentally
>> wrong with the receiver's design. I suspect that isn't it.

> At one time it was very common to use 1uF tantalum capacitors to bypass
> various devices because they would go into oscilation or produce high
> frequency hash without them. In the 1970's they were "required" for both
> input and output sides of three terminal voltage regulators.
>
> Over the years most of them have failed, some with a loud bang, some with
no
> noticable effect. It's quite possible there are a few bypass caps that
worked
> perfectly fine when the receiver was built that no longer do anything at
all.

No argument! But that wasn't what the poster said. (See above.)

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Pub with No Beer lives here
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/fdc9e8deb85361b4?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Jan 6 2011 2:12 am
From: "Dave Plowman (News)"

In article <8okpptF7gdU1@mid.individual.net>,
Phil Allison <phil_a@tpg.com.au> wrote:
> ( all apologies to Slim Dusty )

Be more to the point if you apologised to everyone here and elsewhere for
your behaviour which is more akin to a petulant 5 year old.

--
*A snooze button is a poor substitute for no alarm clock at all *

Dave Plowman dave@davenoise.co.uk London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Jan 6 2011 3:56 am
From: "William Sommerwerck"

> all apologies to Slim Dusty

Who's Slim Dusty? Any relation to Norm Peterson?

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Jan 6 2011 4:26 am
From: Jeffrey Angus

On 1/6/2011 5:56 AM, William Sommerwerck wrote:
>> all apologies to Slim Dusty
>
> Who's Slim Dusty? Any relation to Norm Peterson?
>
>

Geeze William. Sometimes you frighten me.

David Gordon "Slim Dusty" Kirkpatrick AO, MBE (13 June
1927�19 September 2003) was an Australian country music
singer-songwriter. He was the first Australian to have
a No. 1 Hit song (Pub With No Beer). He received an
unequaled 37 Golden Guitar and two ARIA awards and was
inducted into the ARIA Hall of Fame and the Country Music
Roll of Renown. At the time of his death at the age of
76, Dusty had been working on his 106th album for EMI
Records. In 2007 his domestic record sales in Australia
surpassed seven million.

Oh it's-a lonesome away from your kindred and all
By the campfire at night we'll hear the wild dingoes call
But there's-a nothing so lonesome, morbid or drear
Than to stand in the bar of a pub with no beer

Now the publican's anxious for the quota to come
And there's a far away look on the face of the bum
The maid's gone all cranky and the cook's acting queer
Oh what a terrible place is a pub with no beer

Then the stockman rides up with his dry dusty throat
He breasts up to the bar and pulls a wad from his coat
But the smile on his face quickly turns to a sneer
As the barman says sadly the pub's got no beer

Then the swaggie comes in smothered in dust and flies
He throws down his roll and rubs the sweat from his eyes
But when he is told, he says what's this I hear
I've trudged fifty flamin' miles to a pub with no beer

Now there's a dog on the v'randa, for his master he waits
But the boss is inside drinking wine with his mates
He hurries for cover and he cringes in fear
It's no place for a dog 'round a pub with no beer

And old Billy the blacksmith, the first time in his life
Why he's gone home cold sober to his darling wife
He walks in the kitchen, she says you're early Bill dear
But then he breaks down and tells her the pub's got no beer

Oh it's hard to believe that there's customers still
But the money's still tinkling in the old ancient till
The wine buffs are happy and I know they're sincere
When they say they don't care if the pub's got no beer

So it's-a lonesome away from your kindred and all
By the campfire at night we'll hear the wild dingoes call
But there's-a nothing so lonesome, morbid or drear
Than to stand in the bar of that pub with-a no beer

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Jan 6 2011 4:53 am
From: "Brenda Ann"

"Jeffrey Angus" wrote in message
news:4d25b4e1$0$5565$bbae4d71@news.suddenlink.net...

On 1/6/2011 5:56 AM, William Sommerwerck wrote:
>> all apologies to Slim Dusty
>
> Who's Slim Dusty? Any relation to Norm Peterson?
>
>

Geeze William. Sometimes you frighten me.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I've a few Slim Dusty tracks on my playlist. My favorite is this one:

(I can't vouch for the accuracy of these lyrics, they don't sound exactly
like the track, but are the only ones I can find on the net.)

Don't tell me the Banjo's dead, oh, yes I've heard the tale,
That Banjo isn't dead at all, he's caught the western mail,
He has a lot of friends, you know, among the western men,
He wants to look into their eyes, and grip their hands again.

He wants to spend some quiet nights beneath the western stars,
And hear the evening wind again, among the green galahs
So if you tell me Banjo's dead, just say that it's a lie,
He comes from where they breed 'em tough, and Banjo will not die.

They say that Clancy sent him word, he's at the Overflow,
But many more old mates of his, who knew him long ago,
there's a man from Snow River, from Kosciusko side,
Who brought the wild mob in alone, and showed them how to ride.

He's got his mountain pony too, as tough and wirey yet,
As when he chased the brumby mob, the colt from Old Regret.
Another chap, now what's his name, oh, he comes from Ironbark,
He thought the barber cut his throat, and he didn't cop that lark.

All these old mates of his are there, with others on the way,
An' when he got a call from them, how the hell could Banjo stay,
there's Gundagai an' Salt Bush Bill, a rough and rugged pair,
I bet there'll be some fun you know, when Banjo meets them there.

Old trooper Scott is comin' too, to represent the force,
And Andy Reagan or his ghost on Father Riley's horse,
They're makin' for the Overflow, an' when they all arrive,
you'll see that Banjo isn't dead mate, he's very much alive.

They'll hold a racing match of course, you bet yur life they will,
And there'll be fun with Gundagai and tough old Salt Bush Bill,
Old Parden will be hard to beat, they say he knows the track,
But Swagman Claps will run in close, With Ryan on his back,

And near at hand old Rio Grand is sure to make a claim,
But bold McPherson ridin� hard, a horseman grim and game,
I see them racing neck an' neck and as they near the post,
Old Fawkin Bella hits the front with Reagan or his ghost.

Old Fawkin Bella hits the front and as they pass the judge,
A yell goes up from uncle Greg, the poor old station grudge
Who with the boy strapped on his back, through swirling floods and foam,
Swam bravely through the pitch black night, to bring the youngster home.

Old Mongrel Grey has beat 'em all, and honest horse and true,
But Clancy glad to see when and so is Banjo too.
Then glasses clink and healths are drunk and many a tale is told,
Of roving days and droving days that never will grow old.

Yes the seasons come, the seasons go and little here abides,
But good old Banjo will not die as long as Clancy Rides,
As long as bushmen love a horse, the wild swan swim on by,
As long as there's a Southern Cross, the Banjo will not die.

So send the joyous news abroad thru Huttons shearing shed,
And tell the bushmen not to grieve, that Banjo is not dead.
Yes tell the bushman not to grieve, for Banjo is not dead.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Lexicon PCM70 legacy digital effects unit ...
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/17f3dc5cf3d1cb36?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 5 ==
Date: Thurs, Jan 6 2011 4:22 am
From: Bill Palmer

On Thu, 6 Jan 2011 09:10:39 +1100 "Phil Allison" <phil_a@tpg.com.au> wrote
in Message id: <8ok8j1FgckU1@mid.individual.net>:

>
>"Bill Palmer is a WANKER"
>
>>>
>>>"Arfuckwit Daily"
>
>( snip the fool's pathetic drivel )
>
>>>
>>>** But there's-a nothing so lonesome, morbid or drear....
>>>
>>>
>>>than some fucking pile of FAULTY digital shit that is over 20 years old.
>>>
>>>Get real - you stupid, pommy fuckhead.
>>
>> I don't know what your problem is,
>
>
>** You one of the fuckwit troll's sockpuppets ?

Unable to parse headers, eh?

You know something, Phil? If brains were Vaseline, you wouldn't have
enough to lube your prodigious bunghole with.

Now run along like a good little boy before I become cross.

== 2 of 5 ==
Date: Thurs, Jan 6 2011 4:44 am
From: Archon

On 1/5/2011 9:46 PM, Arfa Daily wrote:
>
>
> "Jeff Liebermann" <jeffl@cruzio.com> wrote in message
> news:eok9i6d1fpab4vus7dv6pknfor74u43u03@4ax.com...
>> On Wed, 5 Jan 2011 10:18:05 -0000, "Arfa Daily"
>> <arfa.daily@ntlworld.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Bit of a long shot, but I don't suppose anyone on here has got a
>>> scrap one
>>> of these languishing up a corner in their cellar or wherever ? Owner
>>> of a
>>> shop that I do a lot of work for has been given one of these lovely old
>>> units, but the VFD is busted. Other than that, it all seems to work just
>>> fine. It's an NEC 16 character 'starburst' type. Seems its actual
>>> number is
>>> FIP16A5. There are references on the 'net, but no one stocking such
>>> an item
>>> even as NOS. Anyone help ?
>>
>> You have the part number mangled. It's an NEC FIP1615R.
>> Plenty of substitutes available:
>> <http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=260659423706>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
>
>
> Nope. My varifocals are working just fine. It says on the display, very
> clearly NEC FIP16A5 although the "1" could also be another "I" or vice
> versa, as they appear indistinguishable from each other. The one in the
> link on flea bay, is a one-off second hand one, and appears to match my
> part number. Archon already pointed me at that one earlier in the
> thread. Unfortunately, the seller does not ship worldwide as part of his
> sale conditions, and because it is on the U.S. site and we are accessing
> from a UK account, it won't even let us mail the seller direct to ask if
> he would consider shipping it to the UK. We are currently working on
> that problem via a different route.
>

You can't use Ebay messages to contact a US seller from the UK site?
That's interesting.
JC

== 3 of 5 ==
Date: Thurs, Jan 6 2011 5:45 am
From: "Arfa Daily"

"Jeff Liebermann" <jeffl@cruzio.com> wrote in message
news:k6mai6dvudusiieer821rk483hai9pi2hf@4ax.com...
> On Thu, 6 Jan 2011 02:46:58 -0000, "Arfa Daily"
> <arfa.daily@ntlworld.com> wrote:
>
>
>>It would be appreciated. Putting FIP1615R into Goggle yields
>>no results, other than entries from this thread.
>
> Oops. Try searching for NEC FIP16A5R instead. My typo error. Ok,
> for penetance, I'll do some digging.
>
> This looks interesting:
> <http://vintageplanet.nl>
> Stocks PCM-70 parts, but not the display. Might be worth a phone call
> to see if he has any pointers.
>
> Digging through this thread:
> <http://www.gearslutz.com/board/geekslutz-forum/41160-looking-pcm-70-screen.html>
> there are some interesting hints. Message #6 looks interesting:
> <http://www.gearslutz.com/board/2038735-post6.html>
>
> Search Digikey for D0116SY-20-1601FB-ND. Looks promising if it's the
> same size. That leads to:
> <http://www.newhavendisplay.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=23_127>
> which makes similar displays.
>
> List of VFD manufactories:
> <http://www.maxim-ic.com/app-notes/index.mvp/id/1154>
>
> Various candidates from Futaba:
> <http://www.futaba.com/products/displays/files/30.pdf>
> <http://www.futaba.com/products/displays/files/33.pdf>
> <http://www.futaba.com/products/displays/files/35.pdf>
>
> Can I go back to work now?
>
> --
> # Jeff Liebermann 150 Felker St #D Santa Cruz CA 95060

Yessir ! You can ....

Thanks for that. I'll check them out

Arfa

== 4 of 5 ==
Date: Thurs, Jan 6 2011 5:51 am
From: "Arfa Daily"

"Archon" <Chipbee40_SpamNo@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:jOiVo.652690$Is6.434676@en-nntp-13.dc1.easynews.com...
> On 1/5/2011 9:46 PM, Arfa Daily wrote:
>>
>>
>> "Jeff Liebermann" <jeffl@cruzio.com> wrote in message
>> news:eok9i6d1fpab4vus7dv6pknfor74u43u03@4ax.com...
>>> On Wed, 5 Jan 2011 10:18:05 -0000, "Arfa Daily"
>>> <arfa.daily@ntlworld.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Bit of a long shot, but I don't suppose anyone on here has got a
>>>> scrap one
>>>> of these languishing up a corner in their cellar or wherever ? Owner
>>>> of a
>>>> shop that I do a lot of work for has been given one of these lovely old
>>>> units, but the VFD is busted. Other than that, it all seems to work
>>>> just
>>>> fine. It's an NEC 16 character 'starburst' type. Seems its actual
>>>> number is
>>>> FIP16A5. There are references on the 'net, but no one stocking such
>>>> an item
>>>> even as NOS. Anyone help ?
>>>
>>> You have the part number mangled. It's an NEC FIP1615R.
>>> Plenty of substitutes available:
>>> <http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=260659423706>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
>>
>>
>> Nope. My varifocals are working just fine. It says on the display, very
>> clearly NEC FIP16A5 although the "1" could also be another "I" or vice
>> versa, as they appear indistinguishable from each other. The one in the
>> link on flea bay, is a one-off second hand one, and appears to match my
>> part number. Archon already pointed me at that one earlier in the
>> thread. Unfortunately, the seller does not ship worldwide as part of his
>> sale conditions, and because it is on the U.S. site and we are accessing
>> from a UK account, it won't even let us mail the seller direct to ask if
>> he would consider shipping it to the UK. We are currently working on
>> that problem via a different route.
>>
>
> You can't use Ebay messages to contact a US seller from the UK site?
> That's interesting.
> JC

Well, you certainly used to be able to, but things change on eBay all the
time. I'm relying here on what my mate who owns the thing said when he
tried. He has a shop, and buys and sells on eBay all the time, so is an
experienced user. The first problem that he ran into when he tried to do a
"buy now" was that international sales were not supported by this seller as
one of his conditions, When he then tried to "contact seller", it wouldn't
let him, just putting up a series of questions and answers, I think he said.
Now, whether that is because he has this 'no international sales' thing set
or not, I really don't know. However, we've now been able to contact the guy
by a different route, and he has agreed that he will ship to the UK.

Arfa

== 5 of 5 ==
Date: Thurs, Jan 6 2011 6:24 am
From: Archon

On 1/6/2011 8:51 AM, Arfa Daily wrote:

>>> that problem via a different route.
>>>
>>
>> You can't use Ebay messages to contact a US seller from the UK site?
>> That's interesting.
>> JC
>
> Well, you certainly used to be able to, but things change on eBay all
> the time. I'm relying here on what my mate who owns the thing said when
> he tried. He has a shop, and buys and sells on eBay all the time, so is
> an experienced user. The first problem that he ran into when he tried to
> do a "buy now" was that international sales were not supported by this
> seller as one of his conditions, When he then tried to "contact seller",
> it wouldn't let him, just putting up a series of questions and answers,
> I think he said. Now, whether that is because he has this 'no
> international sales' thing set or not, I really don't know. However,
> we've now been able to contact the guy by a different route, and he has
> agreed that he will ship to the UK.
>
> Arfa

Ah, the pre answered questions thing, totally useless.
At the bottom of that list of options it says "other", if you choose
that it will lead you to a point where you can actually contact the
seller. Infuriating.

Good to hear you got it all sorted.
JC

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Site to open the blocked sites and blocked and encoded
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/effe020f1869ba1f?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Thurs, Jan 6 2011 4:47 am
From: porxy

Site to open the blocked sites and blocked and encoded

http://forum.agd3as7ab.com/showthread.php?t=759

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Talk website story of www.shoesspring.com
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/868177a83a717979?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Thurs, Jan 6 2011 4:56 am
From: trademall

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sunglasses,timberland boots, now, we hope you enjoy stay with us in
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http://www.shoesspring.com
Shoesspring International Trade CO.,LTD

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Tapco Juice J 2500 slave amp, 2007
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/185ab3fdb182c05a?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Thurs, Jan 6 2011 8:10 am
From: "N_Cook"

Wanging everything with engraving tool + nylon bolt eventually elucidated.
Loss of ch 2 , no prob on its i/p board, due to bad mono/stereo/bridge slide
sw on the ch1 i/p board.
Unusual DC rails for the SMD opamps , will go on my tips files for anyone
else confused by this.
One operates from -113V and -101V supplies and the other 40V and 55V, same
for both ch

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Bad cap outcomes
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/ec9df43e004018a7?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 5 ==
Date: Thurs, Jan 6 2011 8:38 am
From: D Yuniskis

Hi,

I'm wondering what the prevailing approach is when
it comes to dealing with kit that has been found to
have "bad cap-itis". Particularly, PC's.

Do folks exploe the current operating conditions
of the machine *before* re-cap-ping (i.e., see
what supplies are affected, what sorts of ripple
is present, etc.)? Or, do you just replace and
*functionally* retest (i.e., if you haven't
probed the circuit to get an idea for the exact
nature of the problem, probing afterwards at
that level of detail seems to be a contradiction)?

In particular, how do you know if the system has
been operating within "absolute maximum ratings"
while this fault has been present? How do you
know the system's reliability/integrity hasn't
been compromised (so your "fix" is just a
band-aid)?

E.g., I've been recommending disposing of machines
with this problem. The labor to re-cap just doesn't
make sense given the book value of machines that
exhibit these problems -- especially in light of
the fact that you can't be sure that the "repaired"
machine is really "100%" (maybe OK for a machine you
use informally at home, but would you want to *rely*
on it in a commercial environment?).

I suspect most machines are just recapped and re-used
but wanted confirmation or repudiation of that opinion.

Thanks!
--don

== 2 of 5 ==
Date: Thurs, Jan 6 2011 8:36 am
From: "N_Cook"

D Yuniskis <not.going.to.be@seen.com> wrote in message
news:ig4qkb$paa$1@speranza.aioe.org...
> Hi,
>
> I'm wondering what the prevailing approach is when
> it comes to dealing with kit that has been found to
> have "bad cap-itis". Particularly, PC's.
>
> Do folks exploe the current operating conditions
> of the machine *before* re-cap-ping (i.e., see
> what supplies are affected, what sorts of ripple
> is present, etc.)? Or, do you just replace and
> *functionally* retest (i.e., if you haven't
> probed the circuit to get an idea for the exact
> nature of the problem, probing afterwards at
> that level of detail seems to be a contradiction)?
>
> In particular, how do you know if the system has
> been operating within "absolute maximum ratings"
> while this fault has been present? How do you
> know the system's reliability/integrity hasn't
> been compromised (so your "fix" is just a
> band-aid)?
>
> E.g., I've been recommending disposing of machines
> with this problem. The labor to re-cap just doesn't
> make sense given the book value of machines that
> exhibit these problems -- especially in light of
> the fact that you can't be sure that the "repaired"
> machine is really "100%" (maybe OK for a machine you
> use informally at home, but would you want to *rely*
> on it in a commercial environment?).
>
> I suspect most machines are just recapped and re-used
> but wanted confirmation or repudiation of that opinion.
>
> Thanks!
> --don

And what percentage of times do you introduce new problems of disrupted
multi-layer board traces/vias in the act of desoldering/soldering caps ?

== 3 of 5 ==
Date: Thurs, Jan 6 2011 8:42 am
From: Jeffrey Angus

On 1/6/2011 10:36 AM, N_Cook wrote:
> D Yuniskis<not.going.to.be@seen.com> wrote:
>> E.g., I've been recommending disposing of machines
>> with this problem. The labor to re-cap just doesn't
>> make sense given the book value of machines that
>> exhibit these problems -- especially in light of
>> the fact that you can't be sure that the "repaired"
>> machine is really "100%" (maybe OK for a machine you
>> use informally at home, but would you want to *rely*
>> on it in a commercial environment?).
>>
>> I suspect most machines are just recapped and re-used
>> but wanted confirmation or repudiation of that opinion.
>>
>> Thanks!
>> --don
>
>
> And what percentage of times do you introduce new problems of disrupted
> multi-layer board traces/vias in the act of desoldering/soldering caps ?
>
>

Well obviously, using something a bit more suitable
than a Weller soldering gun to do the re-cap helps.

But yeah, I did mine, because I bought a pair of
dells with the cap-itis problems for $50. With $25
worth of caps they're good as new.

Would I do this for a commercial customer? No, I'd
give him $25 for the old machine and have him buy a
new one.

Then fix his old one for myself. ;-)

Jeff

== 4 of 5 ==
Date: Thurs, Jan 6 2011 8:50 am
From: Baron

D Yuniskis Inscribed thus:

> Hi,
>
> I'm wondering what the prevailing approach is when
> it comes to dealing with kit that has been found to
> have "bad cap-itis". Particularly, PC's.
>
> Do folks exploe the current operating conditions
> of the machine *before* re-cap-ping (i.e., see
> what supplies are affected, what sorts of ripple
> is present, etc.)? Or, do you just replace and
> *functionally* retest (i.e., if you haven't
> probed the circuit to get an idea for the exact
> nature of the problem, probing afterwards at
> that level of detail seems to be a contradiction)?
>
> In particular, how do you know if the system has
> been operating within "absolute maximum ratings"
> while this fault has been present? How do you
> know the system's reliability/integrity hasn't
> been compromised (so your "fix" is just a
> band-aid)?
>
> E.g., I've been recommending disposing of machines
> with this problem. The labor to re-cap just doesn't
> make sense given the book value of machines that
> exhibit these problems -- especially in light of
> the fact that you can't be sure that the "repaired"
> machine is really "100%" (maybe OK for a machine you
> use informally at home, but would you want to *rely*
> on it in a commercial environment?).
>
> I suspect most machines are just recapped and re-used
> but wanted confirmation or repudiation of that opinion.
>
> Thanks!
> --don

Its really a matter of horses for courses. Some you do and some you
don't ! I don't recall having further trouble with re-capped PC
mainboards. Having said that not all clients will come back and
complain if the machine fails soon after its been repaired. Its become
to easy to replace rather than repair nowadays !

--
Best Regards:
Baron.

== 5 of 5 ==
Date: Thurs, Jan 6 2011 9:00 am
From: D Yuniskis

On 1/6/2011 9:42 AM, Jeffrey Angus wrote:
> On 1/6/2011 10:36 AM, N_Cook wrote:
>> D Yuniskis<not.going.to.be@seen.com> wrote:
>>> E.g., I've been recommending disposing of machines
>>> with this problem. The labor to re-cap just doesn't
>>> make sense given the book value of machines that
>>> exhibit these problems -- especially in light of
>>> the fact that you can't be sure that the "repaired"
>>> machine is really "100%" (maybe OK for a machine you
>>> use informally at home, but would you want to *rely*
>>> on it in a commercial environment?).
>>>
>>> I suspect most machines are just recapped and re-used
>>> but wanted confirmation or repudiation of that opinion.
>>
>> And what percentage of times do you introduce new problems of disrupted
>> multi-layer board traces/vias in the act of desoldering/soldering caps ?
>
> Well obviously, using something a bit more suitable
> than a Weller soldering gun to do the re-cap helps.
>
> But yeah, I did mine, because I bought a pair of
> dells with the cap-itis problems for $50. With $25
> worth of caps they're good as new.
>
> Would I do this for a commercial customer? No, I'd
> give him $25 for the old machine and have him buy a
> new one.

Assuming the old one is *worth* $25... :>

> Then fix his old one for myself. ;-)

That's my point. If it's something you are going to
use yourself it's a different case -- if you later
see it "acting up", you can shrug your shoulders and
give it the old "heave-ho". OTOH, you wouldn't want to
"do your books" on it... :-/

But, the question still stands: did you *examine*
what was actually happening on the board or just
"blindly" replace all the caps and hope for the best?

==============================================================================
TOPIC: This is Bugging Me
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/f797cb59cf87719f?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Thurs, Jan 6 2011 8:48 am
From: jeff_wisnia

About 10 years ago I installed "touch dimmers" inside four metal bodied
table lamps in our home. We really like them because they eliminate
fumbling for a small switch on the lamp base or bulb socket.

The dimmer in the lamp I sit next to while reading died a few months ago
and I replaced it with a new one, a different brand than the originals.

After installing the replacement that lamp would occasionally shut down
or jump to a different intensity level without my touching it. It would
happen perhaps once a week.

I tried tapping the lamp and its shade with a rolled up magazine to see
if I'd messed up an left a "loose disconnection" somewhere when I
installed the replacement touch dimmer, but that didn't have any effect,
the dimmer stayed where it was set.

Thinking the problem might be caused by line spikes I tried reversing
the non polarized line plug to see if that would make the problem go
away. It didn't.

Last night I found out the cause.

There was a small beetle like flying insect buzzing around inside the
lamp shade and when I saw it bump into the metal body of the lamp the
dimmer shut off. It bumped it a second time and the dimmer came on at
its first intensity.

The bug landed on the wall and I quickly sent it to its reward.

What I don't understand is how a tiny bug like that could have enough
body capacitance to activate the dimmer.

Maybe flying around creates enough static charge on its body that when
it touched the lamp there's enough discharge to trip the dimmer.

Has anyone else ever experienced this bugging of a touch dimmer?

Thanks Guys,

Jeff
--
Jeffry Wisnia
(W1BSV + Brass Rat '57 EE)
The speed of light is 1.8*10e12 furlongs per fortnight.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Thurs, Jan 6 2011 8:52 am
From: "William Sommerwerck"

> I tried tapping the lamp ... with a rolled-up magazine...

Naughty lamp. Naughty lamp!

> What I don't understand is how a tiny bug like that could have
> enough body capacitance to activate the dimmer.
> Maybe flying around creates enough static charge on its body
> that when it touched the lamp there's enough discharge to trip
> the dimmer.

That sounds plausible. Helicopters develop a very high static charge.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Samsung TV
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/cf5e2373e39d7fc0?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Thurs, Jan 6 2011 8:59 am
From: Baron

Baron Inscribed thus:

> Arfa Daily Inscribed thus:
>
>>
>>
>> "Baron" <baron.nospam@linuxmaniac.nospam.net> wrote in message
>> news:ig060g$9f6$1@news.eternal-september.org...
>>> Does anyone know where I can get service information for a Samsung
>>> LCD TV Model LE37R87BDX.
>>>
>>> Google gets lots of hits, but they are all dead ends in one way or
>>> another.
>>>
>>> Mine has just decided to switch itself off and sulk ! :-(
>>>
>>> Thanks.
>>> --
>>> Best Regards:
>>> Baron.
>>
>> OK. Had a word with my mate, and he says that it's pretty much always
>> power supply caps on that model. He reckons that there's about four
>> of 'em which will all have blown their tops, and he says it's obvious
>> as soon as you take the back off. He also said that if it has been a
>> bit iffy at starting up for a while, then sometimes, it also twats
>> the EEPROM, so if there are any further issues after replacing the
>> caps, that will be the cause.
>>
>> Good luck with it ! d;~}
>>
>> Arfa
>
> There are no obvious signs of any damage. No smells, no burning, no
> noise, not that I would have heard it over the program sound. Though
> bad caps was the first thing that I suspected.
>
> I'm going to take it into work with me tomorrow and have a look at the
> power rails with a scope.
>
> I'll report back. Take care.
> Thanks again.
>

Hi Arfa,
Well I scoped the power rails without finding anything I could report as
useful. The ripple that I did find was around 120mv and that was on
the 33v rail. Some really odd waveforms on other pins, but meaningless
without knowing what they were for. I did note that the heatsink for
the CPU got moderately hot over the ten/fifteen minutes that I was
checking voltage lines.

Stuck for the moment. :-(
Thanks:

--
Best Regards:
Baron.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: DISCOVERY CHANNEL
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/a8337414508a3426?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Thurs, Jan 6 2011 9:14 am
From: Eli Bourgeois

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sci.electronics.repair - 25 new messages in 10 topics - digest

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