sci.electronics.repair@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

* Old style filament lamps? - 10 messages, 7 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/8b70a4142ec9c2ec?hl=en
* Ganged Pots - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/ed76e380cee9ebeb?hl=en
* Vietnamese Marshall - 3 messages, 2 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/83dfedaa7815fcd1?hl=en
* Annoying Clock on Microwave - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/408849711f765a28?hl=en

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TOPIC: Old style filament lamps?
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/8b70a4142ec9c2ec?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Apr 29 2011 3:39 pm
From: Father Haskell

On Apr 29, 8:05 am, "William Sommerwerck" <grizzledgee...@comcast.net>
wrote:
> > Probably warm / soft white; any other fluorescent is
> > horror movie lighting.  If you don't have the color temp
> > spec, hold a lit, known temperature bulb next to it and
> > see if it looks redder, bluer, or the same.
>
> It is difficult to specify a "color temperature" for a non-continuous
> source.
>
> The bare bulbs look "white", leaning a bit to the warm side.

It's amazing how blue a 3500K warm white bulb will look when
held next to a 2700K.

== 2 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Apr 29 2011 3:48 pm
From: Father Haskell

On Apr 29, 3:50 pm, lsmartino <luismartin...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I personally hate 6500 K lamps for general household use except inside
> a task lamp. I think they don´t have a place in a household, perhaps
> in a kitchen but they are too bluish for my tastes. In a commercial
> environment they are ok, or in a photographic studio, but not in a
> household.

26/100 watt 6500s are excellent for growing plants under.
42/150s are even better, but cost twice as much for 50%
more output.

> In the end, I think that CFL´s will be superseded by led lamps, once
> that led lamps become more powerful for general use. Problem is that
> regarding light quality, led lamps have the same shortcomings of CFL
> ´s, at least right now.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

LEDs are point sources and produce harsher, less
comfortable light.

== 3 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Apr 29 2011 4:25 pm
From: "William Sommerwerck"

> LEDs are point sources and produce harsher, less
> comfortable light.

GE is or will be selling LED lamps in conventional bulbs.

== 4 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Apr 29 2011 4:31 pm
From: "William Sommerwerck"

> I still prefer [halogens] for paint and finishing work, where
> I need more accurate color (halogens are second only to
> sunlight) and shadow rendition [???].

Regardless of perceived color temperature, a discontinuous source is more
likely to cause problems with metamerism.

Given proper filtration, any tungsten source should be fully equal to
daylight.

By the way, noon daylight appears, to me, slightly yellow.

== 5 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Apr 29 2011 4:33 pm
From: "Phil Allison"

"Father Haskell"

Flicker frequency? CFLs flicker in the kHz range. Imperceptable.

** The light of a CFL is modulated at 100 Hz too.

Cos the internal DC supply is very poorly filtered.

In general, the 100Hz ( or 120Hz) light modulation is less than experienced
with regular fluoros and low wattage ( 60 or 70 W) incandescent lamps.

.... Phil

== 6 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Apr 29 2011 4:36 pm
From: spamtrap1888

On Apr 29, 12:11 pm, "William Sommerwerck"
<grizzledgee...@comcast.net> wrote:

> There are multiple issues.
>
> People are used to lights reaching "full" brightness very quickly. This is
> of no concern to me, if the lamp more-than-sufficiently bright when it's
> turned on. (This one reason I use only 90W or 100W-equivalent CFLs. When
> you're using only one-fourth the energy of a standard incandescent, why use
> anything smaller?)

My torchieres were designed to fit 50-100-150 W bulbs. No one makes a
globe or bullet brightness equivalent, much less a three-way CFL. I
tried a "100 W equivalent" twisty bulb, and promptly brushed it
against the ceiling, turning my living room into a hazmat scene.

>
> People object to the shape of coiled CFLs -- at least when they're visible.
> The choice of shade should fix this.

I should just throw away my torchiere lamps? Already I can find no CFL
equivalent for my 60 W hall fixture -- an incandescent bulb that has
lasted at least 20 years -- it hasn't been changed since we bought the
house. I guess I'll stock up on clears since it is a cloudy decorated
globe fixture.

== 7 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Apr 29 2011 6:39 pm
From: lsmartino

On 29 abr, 19:33, "Phil Allison" <phi...@tpg.com.au> wrote:
> "Father Haskell"
>
> Flicker frequency?  CFLs flicker in the kHz range.  Imperceptable.
>
> ** The light of a CFL is modulated at 100 Hz too.
>
> Cos the internal DC supply is very poorly filtered.
>
> In general, the 100Hz ( or 120Hz) light modulation is less than experienced
> with regular fluoros and low wattage ( 60 or 70 W) incandescent lamps.
>
> ....  Phil

That is also true. Specially in cheap (read: bad quality) CFL´s. The
effect becomes worse as the CFL ages, I guess that happens because the
poor quality filter caps inside the ballast lose capacitance as the
heat generated by the electronics cooks them.

Inside brand CFL´s I have found 105ºC caps inside, cheap ones usually
have 85ºC caps and with less capacitance. In some CFL´s the internal
fuse opens when one of the filter capacitors fail shorted, often after
venting, in some others the filter capacitor just opens electrically
and the CFL starts to flicker badly at 120 Hz. That also happens with
cheap chinese ballasts for linear fluorescent tubes.

One more reason to avoid *no name* CFL´s.

== 8 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Apr 29 2011 7:05 pm
From: "hrhofmann@att.net"

On Apr 29, 8:44 am, "Geoffrey S. Mendelson" <g...@mendelson.com>
wrote:
> Arfa Daily wrote:
> > Yes indeed - I am colour blind, and if that is what makes the difference
> > between someone who does have an issue with CFLs, and someone who doesn't,
> > then 12%  - one eighth -  of the population being forced to suffer because
> > of this legislation, seems a pretty poor show of arrogance by the powers
> > that be, in insisting that we suffer in the way that we are being made
>
> That's an interesting point. If 12% of the population is aflicted with a
> gentic disorder, or one caused by a disease or trauma, then the National
> Health should provide them with incadescent bulbs and a susbidy for
> electricity to run them.
>
> I know the US has the "Americans with Disabilities Act" that would require
> it, and I'm sure there is something in British or EU law like that.
>
> I would persue it based on what the National Health does for people
> with macular degeneration and work backwards. At what point is the
> inability to see defined and where does color blindness affect your
> daily life.
>
> Geoff.
>
> --
> Geoffrey S. Mendelson N3OWJ/4X1GM
> Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to misquote it.

Geof:

You and a previous poster are sexist. It is 12% of males that are
color-blind to varying degrees. That's only 6% of the total
population if we assume more or less equal males and females.

== 9 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Apr 29 2011 7:25 pm
From: josephkk

On Fri, 29 Apr 2011 17:56:52 +0100, "Arfa Daily" <arfa.daily@ntlworld.com>
wrote:

>
>
>"Terry Pinnell" <terrypingm@DELETEgmail.com> wrote in message
>news:jhqlr6pjpkocn6uv6iel56b1kspatujmud@4ax.com...
>> adrian@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Adrian Tuddenham) wrote:
>>
>>>Terry Pinnell <terrypingm@DELETEgmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> adrian@poppyrecords.invalid.invalid (Adrian Tuddenham) wrote:
>>>>
>>>> >Terry Pinnell <terrypingm@DELETEgmail.com> wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >> (Re-posted from the lower traffic sci.electronics.misc group.)
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Does anyone know where I can buy 'normal' filament lamp bulbs in the
>>>> >> UK
>>>> >> please? I just cannot get on with the new economy type. My remaining
>>>> >> stock
>>>> >> of 60W and 100W is dwindling rapidly.
>>>> >
>>>> >http://www.wrightshardware.co.uk/Eaccess.htm
>>>>
>>>> Thanks Adrian. Phoned at 7pm but I see they're closed all day Thursdays
>>>> anyway. I'll try again on Saturday after the Wedding. Doesn't look like
>>>> they have any online ordering but presumably they will despatch? Bath's
>>>> a
>>>> little too far to justify the trip!
>>>
>>>He told me he intends to open the shop tomorrow (Friday).
>>>
>>>I warned him that, if he had a website, people would expect him to do
>>>mail order, but I don't know if he is ready for it yet.
>>
>> Adrian: I phoned this morning but it appears as you suspected that Mr
>> Wright supplies only to those visiting his shop. He did say he'd have a
>> think and "talk to Adrian...". However, I'm pleased to say I've now found
>> another local source. I bought 20 x 60W and they've ordered the same
>> number of 100W.
>>
>> BTW, I was surprised to learn that no 'pearl' types are now made, all are
>> clear glass.
>>
>> --
>> Terry, East Grinstead, UK
>
>Yes Terry. See my other posts making mention of this. Apparently, pearlised
>types were the first to be phased out, because they consume more energy to
>make than clear ones. Oh brother ! And I suppose that CFLs, with their
>hundreds of manufacturing processes, don't ... ?
>
>Arfa

We should all know by now that the eco-nazis don't do energy accounting in
any reasonable way.

== 10 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Apr 29 2011 9:33 pm
From: "Phil Allison"

<hrhofmann@att.net>

You and a previous poster are sexist. It is 12% of males that are
color-blind to varying degrees.

Here is what I wrote, you idiot:
------------------------------------------------------------------
12% of all males are colour blind - ie they fail one of the basic tests.

Only 1 or 2% of females are so afflicted - but THEY are the CARRIERS !

------------------------------------------------------------------

That's only 6% of the total
population if we assume more or less equal males and females.

** Silly and irrelevant.

.... Phil

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Ganged Pots
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/ed76e380cee9ebeb?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Apr 29 2011 4:07 pm
From: Pilgrim

Allen Bradley used to make "Mod Pots". Didn't some one else pick up this
line after they stopped? What value/s do you need? I have some new old
stock.

Chuck P.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Vietnamese Marshall
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/83dfedaa7815fcd1?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 3 ==
Date: Fri, Apr 29 2011 4:45 pm
From: "Phil Allison"

"Arfa Daily"
"Phil Allison"
>
>>> I have three different issue numbers of schematics for the MA100, but
>>> none seem to identify specifically an MA100 "H". If they are any use to
>>> you, contact me off-group.
>>
>> ** Marshall sell ( note not make) an MA100H and an MA100C.
>>
>> H = head and C = combo.
>>
>> Decades ago, H-H made an amp called the MA100.
>
> So are my schematics for the Marshall MA100 any use to you ? If so,
> contact me and I'll send them to you ...

** You can send them to " rode@sound.au.com " if you like.

..... Phil

== 2 of 3 ==
Date: Fri, Apr 29 2011 6:39 pm
From: "Arfa Daily"

"Phil Allison" <phil_a@tpg.com.au> wrote in message
news:9210snFekpU1@mid.individual.net...
>
> "Arfa Daily"
> "Phil Allison"
>>
>>>> I have three different issue numbers of schematics for the MA100, but
>>>> none seem to identify specifically an MA100 "H". If they are any use to
>>>> you, contact me off-group.
>>>
>>> ** Marshall sell ( note not make) an MA100H and an MA100C.
>>>
>>> H = head and C = combo.
>>>
>>> Decades ago, H-H made an amp called the MA100.
>>
>> So are my schematics for the Marshall MA100 any use to you ? If so,
>> contact me and I'll send them to you ...
>
>
> ** You can send them to " rode@sound.au.com " if you like.
>
>
> ..... Phil
>

Done.

Arfa

== 3 of 3 ==
Date: Fri, Apr 29 2011 9:36 pm
From: "Phil Allison"

"Arfa Daily"

>>> So are my schematics for the Marshall MA100 any use to you ? If so,
>>> contact me and I'll send them to you ...
>>
>>
>> ** You can send them to " rode@sound.au.com " if you like.
>>
>
> Done.

** Thanks.

I'll let you know if they are for the same amp.

..... Phil

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Annoying Clock on Microwave
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/408849711f765a28?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Apr 29 2011 10:15 pm
From: KR

On Apr 29, 3:28 am, josephkk <joseph_barr...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> On Wed, 27 Apr 2011 06:50:05 -0700 (PDT), KR <kenreed1...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
> >On Apr 25, 9:05 pm, "William Sommerwerck" <grizzledgee...@comcast.net>
> >wrote:
> >> >> I find it impossible to believe that /any/ microwave oven
> >> >> would use a crystal or resonator -- which costs money --
> >> >> when the power frequency is /right there/, and free.
> >> > They would use the same crystal as the microprocessor,
> >> > and run the clock in software.
>
> >> I was, of course, referring to a separate crystal (he said, retro-conning
> >> the issue).
>
> >It is possible to have a second crystal, as I have seen a custom IC
> >that included an RTC inside have its own separate 3.579mhz
> >crystal in addition to the crystal for the CPU function. Both
> >connected to the same IC on separate pins.
> >In this case though, this second crystal would be just for the RTC
> >function,
> >as the low speed would save power, and also the rest of the chip would
> >likely be shut down also to save power hence no software clock.
> >This was an early 1990s design
>
> >As microwaves don't have a RTC in them (that I have seen) and simply
> >reset to 12:00 or whatever after a power failure,
> >there is no need for the more sophisticated system described above.
>
> That IS a RTC.  It just has no battery backup to ride through power
> outages.
>
>

Sorry - I was referring to a RTC as a dedicated clock IC either in or
out of a custom IC.
battery backed up

I would think that a microwave clock would be done in software though,
and not have
a dedicated clock section in the custom IC, not that it matters
though.

>
>

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