Digest for sci.electronics.repair@googlegroups.com - 11 updates in 3 topics

"Emran M." <emramm@emramm.com>: Jun 25 02:44PM

How do I get rid of horizontal streaks HP LaserJet 3200m
copies and scans?
 
Whether I copy or scan, I get horizontal streaks like this:
______________________________________
|xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx|
|xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx|
|xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx|
|xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx|
|xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx|
|-------------------------------------|
|xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx|
|xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx|
|-------------------------------------|
|xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx|
|xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx|
|xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx|
|xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx|
|xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx|
|xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx|
|-------------------------------------|
|xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx|
|xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx|
|xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx|
|xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx|
|xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx|
|-------------------------------------|
|xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx|
|xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx|
______________________________________
 
What is the cause and solution for these horizontal streaks?
Ralph Phillips <ralphp@philent.biz>: Jun 25 09:49AM -0500

On 6/25/2016 9:44 AM, Emran M. wrote:
> |xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx|
> ______________________________________
 
> What is the cause and solution for these horizontal streaks?
 
Measure the distance between the streaks.
 
Using the downloadable service manual, or the "Print Quality" help page,
you can isolate which element is contributing to these streaks due to
how far apart they are (each of the rotating elements are a different
diameter, so their tell marks are different spacings apart.)
 
RwP
Oren <Oren@127.0.0.1>: Jun 25 07:55AM -0700

On Sat, 25 Jun 2016 14:44:36 -0000 (UTC), "Emran M."
 
>Whether I copy or scan, I get horizontal streaks like this:
>______________________________________
>|xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx|
 
<snip>
 
>What is the cause and solution for these horizontal streaks?
 
Does the printer menu have an option to clean and calibrate the print
heads? I'd try there, first.
N_Cook <diverse@tcp.co.uk>: Jun 25 04:11PM +0100

On 25/06/2016 15:49, Ralph Phillips wrote:
> how far apart they are (each of the rotating elements are a different
> diameter, so their tell marks are different spacings apart.)
 
> RwP
 
+1
FrozenNorth <frozennorth.ask@gmail.com>: Jun 25 11:33AM -0400

On 2016-06-25 10:49 AM, Ralph Phillips wrote:
> you can isolate which element is contributing to these streaks due to
> how far apart they are (each of the rotating elements are a different
> diameter, so their tell marks are different spacings apart.)
 
True, but also try a new toner cartridge, just to make sure, and that is
the easiest rotating bit to replace.
 
 
--
Froz....
"Emran M." <emramm@emramm.com>: Jun 25 04:16PM

On Sat, 25 Jun 2016 09:49:29 -0500, Ralph Phillips wrote:
 
> you can isolate which element is contributing to these streaks due to
> how far apart they are (each of the rotating elements are a different
> diameter, so their tell marks are different spacings apart.)
 
But the streaks are horizontal, while the rollers must (by nature)
be vertical???
"Emran M." <emramm@emramm.com>: Jun 25 04:17PM

On Sat, 25 Jun 2016 16:11:09 +0100, N_Cook wrote:
 
> +1
 
But the paper scans down in a vertical direction, which
means the rollers must be vertical.
 
Yet, the streaks are horizontal (in the opposite direction
in which the paper physically moves down through the scanner).
"Emran M." <emramm@emramm.com>: Jun 25 04:28PM

On Sat, 25 Jun 2016 11:33:08 -0400, FrozenNorth wrote:
 
> True, but also try a new toner cartridge, just to make sure, and that is
> the easiest rotating bit to replace.
 
But there is no toner in the case of scanning a photo.
 
1. I put the photo in the scanner slot
(the HP LaserJet 3200m is not a flatbed)
 
2. I bring up IrfanView on Windows & select
IrfanView: File > Acquire/Batch Scanning
 
3. That scans the photo into the computer but the
result is horizontal streaks (perpendicular to the direction
of the paper flow).
 
The glass plate inside is about 9 or 10 inches wide and 3/4 inch tall and
I cleaned it before asking you what the problem was.
 
I don't see anything else inside that "sees" the photo other than
that paper-width wide strip of 3/4-inch wide glass.
 
The conundrum is that the streaks are in the opposite direction
as anything that touches the photo (the rollers roll in the vertical
direction but the streaks are in the horizontal direction).
 
That enigma should give me a clue as to what the cause is, but
I can't think of anything that goes horizontally.
 
This is what the HP LaserJet 3200m looks like
https://www.tradebit.com/usr/manuals4u/pub/9002/118383850_HPLaserJet32003200Mservman01.jpg
 
The manual is 10 dollars
https://www.tradebit.com/filedetail.php/118383850-hp-laserjet-3200-3200m-series-service-repair
N_Cook <diverse@tcp.co.uk>: Jun 25 12:46PM +0100

Looks as though the "monostable " timing is from R254 and C230, set by
the output swinging fully negative and reset after the cap discharges.
Normal bias Q213(B) is -1V and goes to -3.3V in DC swing state.
Don't know what is causing the initial disturbance to the bias, but
previously with amps used or stored in damp conditions, I've found it
due to leakage in minor Qs. Owner said its stored indoors and never used
outdoors but rust spots on metalwork and some pcb CuCarbonate green
spots, say otherwise.
Looks like some suck it and see zener clamps to localise down.
jurb6006@gmail.com: Jun 23 07:04PM -0700

My turn.
 
I have been through shit like this and I TINK I can tell you what to do.
 
Mrchanical regulators that use a relay can develop a fault which mak3s the spring stronger. Many of these have a screw setting to set the voltage, but the spring is too strong to allow the current to flow to the field of the alternator (or generator).
 
The cure is to reduce the spind pressure, and that is done by one of two way. One, if possible is to bend the tang to which the spring is attached to reduce its applied pressure. The other way is to overextend the spring to do pretty much the same thing. In each case, you will have to adjust the contacts to prevent overcharging.
 
Some of these regulators were SPDT, and the ideal was at idle the points would be closed at idle, putting the alternator or generator into full output mode. However it didn't always work out. Q@hen the RPMs increased, the contacts of the relay were supposedd to pretty much vibrate. This of course reduced their lifespan and then they had to be replaced. And plenty of people who did not know electronics errantly replaced many alternators when what they reall need was the regulator. Not all the time but enough worth mentioning. I am from a car family, I can BUILD a car from scrap metal.
 
Take the cover off the regualator and do not fuck with that screw adjustment. Look where the spring attaches and bend the tang to reduce the pressure.
 
If it has an electronic regulator, you either need brushes in the alternator or simply to up the idle a bit. It really doesn't cost alot to up the idle. Someone mentioned a smaller pulley. well that might work but then when you crank it up to do real work it will wear and tear on the alternator by orders of magnitude.
 
Actually the easiest way out of this is to just crank up the idle speed until the thing actually charges and be done with it.
 
I got a lifetime of experience with shit like this and that is my recommendation. Take it or leave it. Just turn the damn idle up and forget it.
Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com>: Jun 24 09:47PM -0700


>Mrchanical regulators that use a relay can develop a fault
>which mak3s the spring stronger...
 
Huh? That last time I saw a mechanical regulator was on a generator.
There were a few alternators with mechanical regulators, but they
never worked well. Ever since the 1960's, alternators had electronic
regulators that were usually located INSIDE the alternator housing. I
did have some kind of alternator that I installed in 1960 Ford Falcon
that had an external solid state regulator.
 
>I am from a car family, I can BUILD a car from scrap metal.
 
Except for the engine and running gear, I've helped build vehicles of
sorts out of scrap metal. You can see the modern incantation on New
Year's day as the Cal Poly Rose Float. Powering 25,000 lbs of scrap
metal and soaking wet flowers down the road is not simple easy:
<http://www.asi.calpoly.edu/university_union/rose_float>
<http://www.rosefloat.org>
<https://www.google.com/search?q=cal+poly+rose+float&tbm=isch>
I was involved between approx 1969 and 1971. Cal Poly was famous for
animation on the floats, which was mostly mechanical until 1967, when
I helped switch to electrical using mostly windshield wiper motors.
Eventually, it morphed into a monitor like water canon, which I won't
explain. The problem was with all the electric motors running,
electrical power at idle was at a premium. It wasn't just electrical
power, but also hydraulic power, all originating from a 4 cyl tractor
engine of dubious origin. We could rev the engine, but that produced
too much smoke and noise. So, we introduced a pony engine
specifically to run the hydraulic and electrical stuff thus allowing
the vehicle engine to stay at near idle most of the time. After a few
disgusting failures trying to use junk yard alternators of the era, I
moved up to bigger is better alternators. A few years after I
graduated, the various electrical system was powered by three
alternators and tractor batteries, each running part of the electrical
system and animation. Automation had progressed from me flipping
toggle switched, to cams, to a rats nest of timers, to PLC's, and
finally to computah control with solid state switches.
 
<http://www.cpp.edu/~library/specialcollections/rosefloat/floatimages/1969photo.html>
<http://www.cpp.edu/~library/specialcollections/rosefloat/floatimages/1970photo.html>
<http://www.cpp.edu/~library/specialcollections/rosefloat/floatimages/1971photo.html>
I rode inside the 1971 float acting as the electrical animation
controller, flipping switches in the proper sequence. I also managed
to be located under one of the numerous hydraulic fluid leaks and
finished the parade soaked in hot hydraulic fluid.
 
The kid in the bed would raise himself, rub his eyes, the toys would
bounce around, and then he would lower himself back onto the bed. The
problem was that the kid weighed far too much for the hardware we
used. About 2 weeks after the parade, we returned the float back to
Pomona, where it was shown on campus, and later disassembly. During
disassembly, we discovered that some of the few bolts holding the kid
to the hinge assembly had sheared half way though. I was presented
with one of the bolts, which I still have somewhere.

I can scan some old photos and post them if you want to see vehicular
scrap metal in action. Oh, found one photo:
<http://802.11junk.com/jeffl/pics/jeffl/slides/RoseFloat01.html>
That's me at work. The main hinge is just above my legs. The 4 bolts
and leaky hydraulics are at various points above my head.
 
 
 
--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
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