sci.electronics.repair - 19 new messages in 8 topics - digest

sci.electronics.repair
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Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: dead microwave
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/65285347906fa371?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Fri, Oct 15 2010 3:31 pm
From: Cydrome Leader

james <nospam@nospam.com> wrote:
> Frigidaire, Professional Series PLMV169DCD
>
> When plugged in, no clock is displayed. Nothing. No response to any buttons.
> No lights, no fan, no sound.
> It failed gradually. Starting from a few buttons that didn't work, then
> this.
>
> It is a combo microwave/range hood. I opened up the panel/keyboard. There's
> a layer of grease on the circult board, and some grease droplets dangling on
> wires and connectors. Some greenish(!) grease drips out of connectors. Could
> the grease cause the connectors to fail?
>
> I found on the internet a parts and schematic PDF for this model.
> Unfortunately, the schematic shows everything (relays, transformers, lights,
> fuses, magnetron, motors) but the controller board. Yet the controller board
> is where I want to start debugging since it houses the LCD display and hooks
> up to the keypad. Does anyone know where to get the controller board's
> schematic?
>
> BTW, there's a note inside saying "this device should not be serviced by a
> do-it-yourself repair person". I could understand if it says "this device
> should be serviced only by a qualified person". But why get personal?

That is an odd warning. Microwaves should just state "you will die if you
open this, even if it's unplugged.

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Fri, Oct 15 2010 6:14 pm
From: "Arfa Daily"

"William Sommerwerck" <grizzledgeezer@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:i9aetj$8ke$1@news.eternal-september.org...
>> Surely, the most fundamental first move is to take a meter to the power
>> supply, and see if there is at least some supply to the system control
>> micro etc ? The fact that it's covered in grease may well be neither here
>> nor there as far as the fault goes. Oils and greases are not known for
>> being particularly conductive or corrosive. Dead is a positive problem,
>> and one to which basic faultfinding techniques should be first applied,
>> before going off on an 'if-then-maybe' exercise ...
>
> I'd normally agree, but the fact the unit /slowly/ declined suggests that
> something other than a voltage loss is going on.

Well, not really. Analogue power supplies, such as the ones in microwave
ovens usually are, will die gracefully as a result of bad electrolytics
getting worse.

Arfa

==============================================================================
TOPIC: connecting TTL o/p together
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/ee9dba9a9d28a99c?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Oct 15 2010 4:21 pm
From: "fynnashba@yahoo.com"

Hi l'm building a circuit and l need an 8 input OR gate(does anyone
know of one ?) this is not available so l'm using 74LS32 - Dual input
Quad or gate. the problem is can l connect all the outputs together as
one just like that? thanks

== 2 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Oct 15 2010 4:44 pm
From: Jamie

fynnashba@yahoo.com wrote:
> Hi l'm building a circuit and l need an 8 input OR gate(does anyone
> know of one ?) this is not available so l'm using 74LS32 - Dual input
> Quad or gate. the problem is can l connect all the outputs together as
> one just like that? thanks
If you take 8 small switching PNP transistors and join all the Emitters
and collectors together, you can create a 8 input OR gate. the collector
cluster can connect to one R to common to provide a low side signal on
the output. Each Base of each transistor can be driven with a 10k R from
a TTL level signal, this will provide you 8 inputs. The Emitter cluster
connects to your 5V+ supply..

The output will be at your Collector cluster..

== 3 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Oct 15 2010 4:49 pm
From: Jamie

fynnashba@yahoo.com wrote:

> Hi l'm building a circuit and l need an 8 input OR gate(does anyone
> know of one ?) this is not available so l'm using 74LS32 - Dual input
> Quad or gate. the problem is can l connect all the outputs together as
> one just like that? thanks
I made an error with the last post.

Make the same circuit but use NPN instead of PNP's and just do the
reverse of what I posted before.

Emitter cluster to common, Collector cluster to a Load R from the
5 Volt supply.. 10k driving each NPN for your 8 inputs.
On the Load R, have that go to a NPN stage to invert the output, other
wise, you have a Nor gate instead..

== 4 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Oct 15 2010 5:06 pm
From: sam@repairfaq.org (Samuel M. Goldwasser)

"fynnashba@yahoo.com" <fynnashba@yahoo.com> writes:

Nope. :) But you could use a pair of 74LS32s.

Or any of a zillion other ways of combining gates.

Also search for "open collector".

--
sam | Sci.Electronics.Repair FAQ: http://www.repairfaq.org/
Repair | Main Table of Contents: http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/
+Lasers | Sam's Laser FAQ: http://www.repairfaq.org/sam/lasersam.htm
| Mirror Sites: http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/F_mirror.html

Important: Anything sent to the email address in the message header above is
ignored unless my full name AND either lasers or electronics is included in the
subject line. Or, you can contact me via the Feedback Form in the FAQs.

== 5 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Oct 15 2010 5:27 pm
From: Rich Webb

On Fri, 15 Oct 2010 16:21:34 -0700 (PDT), "fynnashba@yahoo.com"
<fynnashba@yahoo.com> wrote:

>
> Hi l'm building a circuit and l need an 8 input OR gate(does anyone
>know of one ?) this is not available so l'm using 74LS32 - Dual input
>Quad or gate. the problem is can l connect all the outputs together as
>one just like that? thanks

Devices that have "open collector" outputs can, generally, be tied
together. Normal TTL outputs, however, are active (see
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transistor–transistor_logic#TTL_with_a_.22totem-pole.22_output_stage>)
and should not be tied together in this manner.

You can get the results you are looking for just by using a second
74LS32. Take the four outputs of the first one to two gates (four
inputs) on the second. Take the resulting two outputs to one of the
remaining OR gates and you're done, modulo the cumulative effects of the
gate delays.

A "real" 8-to-1 OR-gate could be realized in a small programmable logic
device. A GAL could do this easily but programming one could be a
challenge if you don't have access to a proper device programmer.

I'd go with the two 74LS32s.

--
Rich Webb Norfolk, VA

== 6 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Oct 15 2010 5:55 pm
From: "William Sommerwerck"

No. Connect pairs of dual OR-gate outputs to two dual OR-gates, then those
to a single OR gate. What could be simpler?

== 7 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Oct 15 2010 7:18 pm
From: Randy Day

In article <i9at5o$stl$1@news.eternal-september.org>,
grizzledgeezer@comcast.net says...
> > Hi l'm building a circuit and l need an 8 input OR gate(does anyone
> > know of one ?) this is not available so l'm using 74LS32 - Dual input
> > Quad or gate. the problem is can l connect all the outputs together as
> > one just like that? thanks
>
> No. Connect pairs of dual OR-gate outputs to two dual OR-gates, then those
> to a single OR gate. What could be simpler?

How about 4 diodes and a resistor?
__
-\ \
| |-->|-|
-/__/ |
__ |
-\ \ |
| |-->|-|
-/__/ |
__ |
-\ \ |
| |-->|-+----- out
-/__/ |
__ |
-\ \ |
| |-->|-|
-/__/ |
|
.-.
| | 10k
| |
'-'
|
|
===
GND
(created by AACircuit v1.28.6 beta 04/19/05 www.tech-
chat.de)

== 8 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Oct 15 2010 9:02 pm
From: RosemontCrest

On Oct 15, 7:18 pm, Randy Day <randy....@sasktel.netx> wrote:
> In article <i9at5o$st...@news.eternal-september.org>,
> grizzledgee...@comcast.net says...
>
> > > Hi l'm building a circuit and l need an 8 input OR gate(does anyone
> > > know of one ?) this is not available so l'm using 74LS32 - Dual input
> > > Quad or gate. the problem is can l connect all the outputs together as
> > > one just like that? thanks
>
> > No. Connect pairs of dual OR-gate outputs to two dual OR-gates, then those
> > to a single OR gate. What could be simpler?
>
> How about 4 diodes and a resistor?
> __
> -\ \
> | |-->|-|
> -/__/ |
> __ |
> -\ \ |
> | |-->|-|
> -/__/ |
> __ |
> -\ \ |
> | |-->|-+----- out
> -/__/ |
> __ |
> -\ \ |
> | |-->|-|
> -/__/ |
> |
> .-.
> | | 10k
> | |
> '-'
> |
> |
> ===
> GND
> (created by AACircuit v1.28.6 beta 04/19/05www.tech-
> chat.de)

How about simply 8 diodes and 1 resistor with no gates? Depending on
the load connected to the output, the resistor may not be necessary.

== 9 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Oct 15 2010 9:23 pm
From: Randy Day

In article <79559909-a5f3-4eae-a99d-
1027f71af88c@t20g2000yqa.googlegroups.com>,
rosemontcrest@yahoo.com says...

[snip]

> How about simply 8 diodes and 1 resistor with no gates? Depending on
> the load connected to the output, the resistor may not be necessary.

Very true. The OP said he was using 7432's, but
he could get by without them...

== 10 of 10 ==
Date: Fri, Oct 15 2010 10:13 pm
From: RosemontCrest

On Oct 15, 9:23 pm, Randy Day <randy....@sasktel.netx> wrote:
> In article <79559909-a5f3-4eae-a99d-
> 1027f71af...@t20g2000yqa.googlegroups.com>,
> rosemontcr...@yahoo.com says...
>
> [snip]
>
> > How about simply 8 diodes and 1 resistor with no gates? Depending on
> > the load connected to the output, the resistor may not be necessary.
>
> Very true. The OP said he was using 7432's, but
> he could get by without them...

Some advantages of the diode-only approach may include:

1) It's inexpensive
2) It's easily expanded if another input is desired
3) Small-signal diodes rarely fail, so it's likely to be very reliable
4) Assuming through-hole technology, it can occupy about the same
space as one 16-pin DIP
5) If PCB real estate is limited, leaded-diodes can be incorporated
into wiring harnesses

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Icom IC-7000 VHF/UHF Transceiver "Adjustment Mode"
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/3a6f06853ecffe7c?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Oct 15 2010 5:44 pm
From: Fred McKenzie

In article <0upbb61jot8ptbsgn6rac15r71pri1qvdh@4ax.com>,
jaugustine@verizon.net wrote:

> I downloaded the service manual from www.mods.dk and followed
> the procedure to enter the "Adjustment" mode.

John-

If I understand, you are trying to increase power beyond 100%. My
thought is that you are getting all you can with the hardware you have.
The hardware may be defective and the computer can't compensate for that.

My problem is with frequency adjustment. When I enter the Adjustment
mode, I can set the oscillator frequency to exactly what it should be.
However, frequency returns to the previous value when I leave the
Adjustment mode. If I re-enter Adjustment mode, the oscillator
frequency goes back to the correct value, and again reverts when exiting
Adjustment mode.

Do you or anyone else know what I might be doing wrong? Is there a step
I'm missing that makes changes "take"?

Fred
K4DII

==============================================================================
TOPIC: are you still finding the wholesaler of cheap brand sport shoes?
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/acd15ad2b1550bcf?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Oct 15 2010 5:53 pm
From: amy

happy time:

title: Where's the father

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>>"Yes," said the younger, "but in all these paintings there is only the mother and the

children. Where is the father?"

>>The elder brother thought for a moment and then explained, "Obviously he was painting

the pictures."

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sport shoes,clothes,

timberland shoes and so on,have any questions or needs,pls kindly
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we are waiting for your visiting,welcome to our website!

==============================================================================
TOPIC: we are a professional wholesaler of brand shoes
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/3abee073dbdd340c?hl=en
==============================================================================

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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Driveway sensor, model 917-1, mfg. around 1993 by "Detector Systems"
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/502c70dec1b2d85e?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Oct 15 2010 8:32 pm
From: klem kedidelhopper

On Oct 15, 11:58 am, nesesu <neil_sutcli...@telus.net> wrote:
> On Oct 14, 8:37 pm, klem kedidelhopper <captainvideo462...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Oct 14, 7:48 pm, JeffM <jef...@email.com> wrote:
>
> > > >klem kedidelhopper posted 3 times:
> > > >>Would I be better off with building and burying
> > > >>their smaller coil with more turns or[...]
>
> > > nesesu wrote:
> > > >Yes, Lenny, all three posting came through okay.
>
> > > Heh. Google Groups' quasi-annual takedown for maintenance.
> > > Roughly 10AM - 3PM today.
>
> > > Impatient posters using a Web interface to Usenet
> > > should poll ANOTHER one of those *before* posting *again*.
> > > (Google is NOT the only game in town.)
> > > Here are some with reasonable latency:http://www.electronicskb.com/Default.aspxhttp://www.electrondepot.com/
>
> > Neil
> > When I said "every time" I wasn't thinking of motorcycles. My wife's
> > business which is run out of part of our home is a gift shop catering
> > primarily to women. The shop is off the main road. So considering the
> > clientele we're really not expecting too many bikes in here, and if
> > the occaisional one does come through and does not get detected then
> > its not the end of the world. No, I was referring to the mass of a
> > typical automobilie. The issue is that there are sometimes long
> > periods of time when there is no business. she doesn't want to have to
> > stay down there waiting for a customer to show up. This sensor will
> > allow her to turn out the lights and be in some other part of the
> > house until the alarm sounds. She can then run downstairs, turn on the
> > lights and be "open for business" And so far with the loop laying on
> > the ground its worked every time. You were right on the money with
> > your idea of three turns and a 4 X 8 footprint which is the 72 feet
> > the book talks about. I don't have an impedance bridge.so I can't
> > directly measure inductance, however the instructions did mention an
> > operating frequency of between 30 and 60 KHZ. I suppose that I could
> > look at this with the scope, determine exactly what it is and then
> > figure out a way to determine inductance if I really want to. But for
> > the time being I'm going to rewind the coil for the 6 turns the
> > instructions call for.
> > So now I need to ask for your advice again. Last year I rewired my
> > well. I pulled up 175 feet of the old wire and replaced it. The
> > conductors in that wire were continuous however the insulation was
> > scuffed and scraped and in some cases down to bare copper and no
> > longer servicable for well application. However I kept it around to
> > use for projects, such as this one..Well wire if you've ever worked
> > with it is typically three twisted conductors made from 14AWG. This
> > wire is apparently impervious to moisture because it runs right down
> > the well casing throught the water to the submersible pump. My present
> > test coil is made from some of that old wire.unwound to single srand.
> > The scuffed parts were taped up in places for purposes of this test
> > but it is not in good enough condition to put directly into the
> > ground. I have a gravel driveway and ultimately I will need to bury
> > the final coil amidst this abrasive material.. I could get some more
> > of this well wire or the instructions say that you can directly bury
> > THHN or a similar type of wire. My concern though is the dirt, stones,
> > sand, etc. which would be in constant cantact and abrading this wire.
> > I think that I would like to encase it somehow. ideally in PVC. Then
> > have some kind of an underground junction box to connect my sheilded
> > cable to. Do you have any ideas as to how to do this? Lenny
>
> Lenny, I think that the 'well pump wire' is stranded type TWU . In any
> case it generally has a much thicker insulation intended exactly to
> withstand high abrasion situations such as sliding in and out of well
> casings or being directly buried in the ground. It would not survive
> being shallow buried in a gravel drive for very long. If you can come
> up with the needed length of normal TW or XLPE or the newer Nylon
> coated wire, then I would suggest you buy some 1/2" PVC conduit,
> couplings, glue, 4 90 degree sweep bends and an outlet box with two
> 1/2" hubs on one end and one hub on the other end as well as a blank
> cover for the box. You then form the PVC pipe into the rectangular
> coil form and pull in the wire around the loop the required 5 or 6
> times and splice it to the shielded lead in in the box.
> Please email me directly with your email address and I will send you a
> sketch of how to form the pipe.
> Naturally the pipe should be surrounded with coarse sand to pad it
> from the stones, but since you should be staying within 3" - 4" of the
> surface, you don't have a lot of margin for that.
>
> Neil- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Neil
The well wire is solid 14 AWG. I looked at it again and it is marked
600V type "THW". and I definitely agree that it probably would not
survive the gravel driveway for very long. I was thinking about a
similar idea such as yours but it seems like it would be very hard to
pull, or for want of a better term, "sew" 6 wires into a loop one at a
time through all that pipe and those sweeps. Its virtually impossible
to rtry to add wire to a piece of pipe that already has wire in it.The
only way I would think that you could do it would be to pull 6
individual labeled numbered wires through the pipe, leave all the
fittings loose until all the wires are pulled through. At this point
you would glue the pipe together. Then you would have to splice the
wires together, 1 - 2, 2 - 3, etc. in the junction box to form a coil
with 6 turns. Then I'll have a continuous loop.. The only problem I
could envision is that it might be somewhat difficult to get the
fittings together with the wire in there. I don't know I guess its
worth a shot. I've seen PVC boxes with seals for this type of
underground work at some of the electrical supply houses. I'm going
to a hamfest tomorrow. Maybe I'll run into something there. You never
know. I really appreciate all the time you're taking on this with me.
BTW my email is: captainvideo462002@yahoo.com Best regards, Lenny

==============================================================================
TOPIC: DTV clock screwed up
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/b9dea1469fd82de8?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Fri, Oct 15 2010 9:26 pm
From: David Nebenzahl

Using a set-top DTV converter, analog TV. Works fine, except for about a
week now the clock appears to be an hour slow.

I say "the clock" as if it's part of the converter, but apparently the
box gets the time from the TV stations; I notice the time changes
slightly from channel to channel sometimes. But every channel shows the
clock an hour behind. All other info--program titles, etc.--seems to be
correct.

Any way to fix this? The only options that can be set through the
on-screen menu are:

o Clock: Time zone is selectable (correctly set to Pacific)
Daylight saving option is set to "Auto"

Can't see anything else that can be tweaked here.

So does the STB get the time from the stations? Is there an internal
clock? If so, why can't I set it?

--
The fashion in killing has an insouciant, flirty style this spring,
with the flaunting of well-defined muscle, wrapped in flags.

- Comment from an article on Antiwar.com (http://antiwar.com)

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Sat, Oct 16 2010 12:36 am
From: Ian Jackson

In message <4cb92a37$0$2445$822641b3@news.adtechcomputers.com>, David
Nebenzahl <nobody@but.us.chickens> writes
>Using a set-top DTV converter, analog TV. Works fine, except for about
>a week now the clock appears to be an hour slow.
>
>I say "the clock" as if it's part of the converter, but apparently the
>box gets the time from the TV stations; I notice the time changes
>slightly from channel to channel sometimes. But every channel shows the
>clock an hour behind. All other info--program titles, etc.--seems to be
>correct.
>
>Any way to fix this? The only options that can be set through the
>on-screen menu are:
>
>o Clock: Time zone is selectable (correctly set to Pacific)
> Daylight saving option is set to "Auto"
>
>Can't see anything else that can be tweaked here.
>
>So does the STB get the time from the stations? Is there an internal
>clock? If so, why can't I set it?
>
Have you tried 'lying' to it, and setting the time zone to 'Mountain'?
Or setting the daylight saving to 'manual'? See if this has any effect -
or if the converter ignores you.
--
Ian

==============================================================================
TOPIC: microwave magnetron dead?
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/b9bc1fd33c255c4d?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Fri, Oct 15 2010 10:47 pm
From: lawei1971_at_gmail_dot_com@foo.com (lawei)

responding to
http://www.homeownershub.com/maintenance/microwave-magnetron-dead-400476-.htm
lawei wrote:

mynick wrote:

> no shorts between magnetron contacts or ground but when plugged it
> does not heat the oven contents and has loud hum
> Is it dead(how to make sure) or perhaps requires say 1v higher cathode
> heating voltage than what transformer supplies?

-------------------------------------

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