sci.electronics.repair@googlegroups.com

Today's topics:

* Contactor coil: 50 Hz vs. 60 Hz - 6 messages, 6 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/0d1a06068779ce43?hl=en
* Yellow Glue strikes again - 4 messages, 4 authors
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/9d8bded3db582b06?hl=en
* t.v. volume remains static. - 1 messages, 1 author
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/8fbadf0c35306061?hl=en
* Motor start/stop switch with integrated mini contactor? - 1 messages, 1
author
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/13b233689d902984?hl=en

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Contactor coil: 50 Hz vs. 60 Hz
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/0d1a06068779ce43?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 6 ==
Date: Wed, Aug 31 2011 1:41 pm
From: "Ian Field"

"Jeffrey Angus" <grendelair@aim.com> wrote in message
news:j3m408$fqf$1@dont-email.me...
> On 8/31/2011 2:33 PM, NT wrote:
>> I realised it was perhaps not the best phrasing. But... would the dc
>> component be the average V or the rms?
>
> DC would be the RMS value. Because, RMS means "This is what the DC
> value would be."

Years ago when I needed more power from a soldering iron I used to feed the
240VRMS through a rectifier/reservoir to get aproximately 320VDC.

== 2 of 6 ==
Date: Wed, Aug 31 2011 2:37 pm
From: Spehro Pefhany

On Wed, 31 Aug 2011 12:33:06 -0700 (PDT), NT <meow2222@care2.com>
wrote:

>On Aug 31, 7:11 pm, John S <soph...@invalid.org> wrote:
>> On 8/31/2011 1:06 PM, The Ghost In The Machine wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> > YES A-NT-MAN BUT THE RMS REFERS TO THE AC WAVEFORM NOT THE DC OUTPUT.
>> > HENCE THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS RMS DC VOLTAGE.
>> > PATECUM
>> > TGITM
>
>Root Mean Square does not imply an ac waveform, its jsut most commonly
>used for ac waveforms. Every stable waveform has an rms value, even
>perfect dc.
>
>
>> Actually, RMS DC voltage is a redundant expression since DC is RMS.
>
>I realised it was perhaps not the best phrasing. But... would the dc
>component be the average V or the rms?
>
>
>NT

Generally, in electronics, "DC component" is defined as the average
value (say, over a period of a periodic waveform). So a 1V peak sine
wave sitting on top of 1VDC would have DC component of 1.0V.
A 1V peak sine wave has a DC component of 0.

The RMS value is the heating value- a 1 ohm resistor with 1VDC across
it will dissipate 1W. A 1 ohm resistor with 1.414V peak sine wave
across it (1 V RMS) will dissipate 1W.

A 1 ohm resistor powered with a 1V peak sine wave sitting on top of
1VDC will dissipate a bit more than 1 watt (RMS value is sqrt(3/2) if
you want to get analytical about it, so about 1.22W).

== 3 of 6 ==
Date: Wed, Aug 31 2011 2:57 pm
From: John S

On 8/31/2011 2:33 PM, NT wrote:
> On Aug 31, 7:11 pm, John S<soph...@invalid.org> wrote:
>> On 8/31/2011 1:06 PM, The Ghost In The Machine wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>> YES A-NT-MAN BUT THE RMS REFERS TO THE AC WAVEFORM NOT THE DC OUTPUT.
>>> HENCE THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS RMS DC VOLTAGE.
>>> PATECUM
>>> TGITM
>
> Root Mean Square does not imply an ac waveform, its jsut most commonly
> used for ac waveforms. Every stable waveform has an rms value, even
> perfect dc.
>
>
>> Actually, RMS DC voltage is a redundant expression since DC is RMS.
>
> I realised it was perhaps not the best phrasing. But... would the dc
> component be the average V or the rms?
>
>
> NT

DC is all of the following: Average, Peak, RMS, Mean, Mode, and most
anything else.

John S

== 4 of 6 ==
Date: Wed, Aug 31 2011 5:11 pm
From: Paul Conners

> Generally, in electronics, "DC component" is defined as the average
> value (say, over a period of a periodic waveform). So a 1V peak sine
> wave sitting on top of 1VDC would have DC component of 1.0V.
> A 1V peak sine wave has a DC component of 0.
>
> The RMS value is the heating value- a 1 ohm resistor with 1VDC across
> it will dissipate 1W. A 1 ohm resistor with 1.414V peak sine wave
> across it (1 V RMS) will dissipate 1W.
>
> A 1 ohm resistor powered with a 1V peak sine wave sitting on top of
> 1VDC will dissipate a bit more than 1 watt (RMS value is sqrt(3/2) if
> you want to get analytical about it, so about 1.22W).

Thank you SP. Amid all the chest-pounding and playground antics here I can
actually learn something.

== 5 of 6 ==
Date: Wed, Aug 31 2011 9:54 pm
From: "Don Kelly"

"NT" wrote in message
news:acc067aa-0f17-4b7b-bf83-b69635d726c0@s12g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...

On Aug 31, 1:36 am, John Fields <jfie...@austininstruments.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 30 Aug 2011 05:11:20 -0700 (PDT), NT <meow2...@care2.com>
> wrote:
> >On Aug 30, 12:39 pm, John Fields <jfie...@austininstruments.com>
> >wrote:
> >> On Mon, 29 Aug 2011 07:25:23 -0700 (PDT), NT <meow2...@care2.com>
> >> wrote:
>
> >> >IME relays pull in at in the region of half rated voltage, and dc
> >> >ratings are typically about half the voltage of the ac rating, which
> >> >gives an idea of how much current is determined by L and how much by
> >> >R.
>
> >> ---
> >> IME, most relays (with either AC or DC coils) are guaranteed to pull
> >> in at about 80% of their rated coil voltage, so I'm at a loss trying
> >> to understand what you meant by: "dc ratings are typically about half
> >> of the ac rating."
>
> >> Can you elaborate, please?
>
> >When relays have dual ratings for ac and dc, its normal for the dc
> >voltage rating to be half the ac voltage rating.
>
> >> >Running your relay on 220v 60Hz it will work fine.
>
> >> Knowing nothing about the contactor, other than that it's specified to
> >> energize when 240V 50Hz is placed across the coil, your imprimatur is
> >> premature.
>
> >I really dont agree. I do know the basics about relays, and one
> >normally finds that pull-in occurs at around 50% rated voltage. The OP
> >is welcome to test theirs to see if it behaves the usual way.
>
> >> >Contact closing speed will be slightly slower. Margin will be reduced,
> >> >but its only being reduced from enormous to slightly less enormous,
> >> >so its a non-issue except in very unusual situations.
>
> >> It seems you've forgotten that when the armature makes, and the
> >> magnetic circuit is closed, the inductance of the coil will rise.
>
> >I dont know why you think I've forgotten it. What's relevant here is
> >inductance in the closed position.
>
> I disagree.
>
> Since the relay is open when power is applied to the coil, it's the
> open inductance (and the resistance, of course) which will determine
> how much current will flow through the coil, that current being what
> generates the magnetic field to start the armature on its way.

yup

> Then when the relay closes, the closed inductance comes into play and
> holds the armature in place until the current through the coil is
> reduced to a point where the armature's return spring overcomes the
> weakened magnetic field, allowing the armature to open.

yes. I guess in theory both matter, one determines closing behaviour,
the other ensures the relay doesnt overheat. In practice though the
margins are very large, and its normal to simply fix holding current
to suit the relay, and not worry about closing current, which will be
so close as to make no real world difference in all but exceptional
circumstances. But yes, we can consider both if need be.

> >> Such being the case, the current in it will diminish,
>
> >true with all relays under all ac conditions. Theyre designed to work
> >that way.
>
> >> reducing the
> >> hold on the armature and making the contacts more likely to chatter.
>
> >No, its exactly how theyre designed to operate.
>
> >> >The vibration tolerance of
> >> >the contacts will be little affected in practice; if your environment
> >> >is harsh enough to shake the relay contact open, then you've got
> >> >bigger worries than contacts crackling.
> >> >If instead you meant you would use it on 110v 60Hz, then dont. But you
> >> >could use diodes to get a higher dc voltage and use that.
>
> >> Interesting conjecture.
>
> >Where's the conjecture? I get the feeling you could do with bringing
> >your skills up to speed on relays.
>
> ---
> Perhaps.
> ---
>
> >> Something like this?
>
> >> +-----+
> >> 120AC>--|~ +|----+
> >> | | |
> >> | | [COIL]
> >> | | |
> >> 120AC>--|~ -|----+
> >> +-----+
>
> >That would work.
>
> Not in all cases, certainly.

I'd like to see you find one single electromechanical relay that wont
work for.

> >> Since the coil has an impedance of about 6600 ohms at 50Hz, then the
> >> current through it will be:
>
> >> E 240V
> >> I = --- = ------- = 0.036A = 36mA
> >> Z 6600R
>
> >> Then, since the coil has a resistance of 4800 ohms, the DC voltage
> >> across it required to force 36mA through it would be:
>
> >> E = IR = 0.036A * 4800R ~ 174V.
>
> >You're not saying where you got those figures from.
>
> ---
> The P&B MR5A I talked about in an earlier post, which has a 240V
> 50/60Hz coil, a coil resistance of 4800 ohms, an impedance of ~ 6600
> ohms at 50 Hz, an open inductance of 14.5 henrys, and a closed
> inductance of 16 henrys

> >Typically dc rating is half ac rating.
>
> But I don't think "typical" is what we're after since we want
> something that will _always_ work.

This 2:1 ratio normally is good for relays, and the OP can check his
to see if it conforms to that. If it does, the thing will always work
when subject to this formula.

FWIW, when ac is applied you get puling force plus vibration. With dc
there is no vibration component when its closed, so less holding
current is needed. How much less I've really no idea.

Some relays are fast movers capable of 100s of Hz, some are slow. Ac
relays can always work on dc, but dc ones often dont work ok on ac.

> Since current is what's doing the work, my real-world example shows
> that 240V 50 Hz RMS impressed across a load with an impedance of 6600
> ohms will force 36mA RMS of current through the load.
>
> Then, since it's current that's doing the work, 36mA of DC through the
> coil should accomplish the same thing.
> ---
>
> >> The peak voltage out of the bridge would be:
>
> >> E = RMS * sqrt(2) = 120 * 1.414 ~ 170V.
>
> >> Pretty close, but at 120Hz, the reactance of the coil would increase,
> >> limiting the current to something less than the 36mA needed to close
> >> the armature.
>
> >The effect of the relay's inductance, when run off a BR, is simply to
> >smooth the current flow somewhat.
>
> ---
> Yeah, I know, said so earlier, and posted a simulation showing the
> ripple.
> ---
>
> >Mean current remains much the same.
> >So we're looking for 120v rms, which is what the BR would deliver.
>
> ---
> But, what it won't deliver is the worst-case voltage required over the
> interval required to guarantee the armature will close.

Re ripple: If the relay is designed to run on ac 50 or 60Hz, its
designed and rated to live with the current and force variations that
go along with that, 100-120 times a second. Running it on rectified
mains will only serve to reduce the current variations through the
cycle, it wont cause the relay any issues.

Re rms voltage: With my 2:1 figures, rectified 120v is spot on. With
your 174v figure, 120v is well within the 50% margin. Of course for
some uses that margin would need to be confirmed by testing before
production, and reconfirmed if a new relay type is used. Or as you
say, a cap could be added. Or for off brand consumer goods, in it
goes, relays are good for it.

> >> However, the reactance of the coil will smooth the current and the
> >> addition of a capacitor in parallel with the coil will remove some of
> >> the ripple and allow the coil to see more nearly pure DC.
>
> >and overheat the relay by increasing its rms dc voltage to above 120v.
>
> There's no such thing as "rms dc voltage",

RMS can be applied to any and every waveform, dc included. Its very
relevant when working with rectified ac, semismoothed or unsmoothed.

> and if the relay is
> designed to operate on AC with a certain RMS current in its coil, how
> can it possibly overheat if that current is DC?

With the same current it wont, with higher curren ti will. IIRC you
proposed using 174v rms, that would be ok on your specific relay, but
not a universal solution.

NT
-----------------------
I sense a bit of cross confusion in this thread.

a)Do not the AC/DC ratings refer to the contact rating rather than the coil
rating? As with any switch, there is a big derating of contacts designed for
AC use but applied to DC- Example a typical 120V 15 A light switch would
fail at 15A 120V DC- it might work at 15A, 12V. Older switches with good
snap contacts do much better.

You indicate experience for the factor of 2:1- but is this something that
translates across the AC/DC barrier?

b) John indicates 174VDC giving 0.036A would be OK- for closing. However
when closed, the holding current will be 0.031A and this is the steady state
current that is involved in heating when the relay is closed. For DC the
voltage would need to be about 150VDC [ (174*0.031/0.036)^2]. So it
remains to be seen if that is sufficient to close the relay. According to
you- it would be more than adequate. From John's 80% criterion it is
inadequate.- so point (c).

c) The peak force is related to the square of peak flux For AC, this is
proportional to (Vrms/f)^2 independent of the magnetic medium. The magnetic
medium determines the corresponding peak current. While a DC current of
0.036A corresponds to an rms current of the same magnitude, and the average
force is the same, at that current, as the average force in the AC case, it
is well below the peak force (about a factor of 2, ). This may have have a
bearing on the relay's operation- just a conjecture.

Don Kelly
cross out to reply

> >> WINDOW 3 32 32 VTop 0
> >> SYMATTR InstName C1
> >> SYMATTR Value 10µ
> >> TEXT -298 246 Left 0 !.tran .05
>
> >> If the relay is spec'ed as "must make" at 80% of rated current through
> >> the coil (~29mA), then note that with a 10µF cap in parallel with the
> >> coil the relay will _always_ make using full-wave rectified 120V 60Hz
> >> mains.
>
> --
> JF

== 6 of 6 ==
Date: Wed, Aug 31 2011 10:54 pm
From: "Michael A. Terrell"

John S wrote:
>
> On 8/31/2011 1:06 PM, The Ghost In The Machine wrote:
> >
> > YES A-NT-MAN BUT THE RMS REFERS TO THE AC WAVEFORM NOT THE DC OUTPUT.
> > HENCE THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS RMS DC VOLTAGE.
> > PATECUM
> > TGITM
>
> Actually, RMS DC voltage is a redundant expression since DC is RMS.

RMS = 'Roy? Mouthy & Stupid.'

--
You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense.

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Yellow Glue strikes again
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/9d8bded3db582b06?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Aug 31 2011 3:10 pm
From: Andrew Rossmann

In article <9c5fb1FhtrU1@mid.individual.net>, phil_a@tpg.com.au says...
> Are the dickheads who squirt this horrible goop all over PCBs NEVER
going
> to wake up ??

As long as it lasts through the warranty, they don't care.

--
If there is a no_junk in my address, please REMOVE it before replying!
All junk mail senders will be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the
law!!
http://home.comcast.net/~andyross

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Aug 31 2011 3:18 pm
From: Meat Plow

On Wed, 31 Aug 2011 10:59:58 +1000, Phil Allison wrote:

> ** I had hoped that the dreaded Yellow Glue peril had gone away - but it
> is still with us.
>
> Most of you will have seen it holding parts down to PCBs on Asian made
> equipment and many of those will have seen what happens if the parts
> involved get hot.
>
> The example on my bench is the SMPS from an Alesis powered monitor ( M1
> Active, Chinese made) ) which has blown up big time because of the damn
> Yellow Glue used to secure a ferrite toroidal coil. All the glue used
> had gone brown or back ( ie carbonised ) on this coil and arced across
> nearby tracks taking out the main switching MOSFET, its drive IC and
> associated transistors, high speed diodes and even the AC bridge
> rectifier diodes.
>
> The toroidal coil had to be un-wound, cleaned up and re-wound. The same
> glue was attacking parts elsewhere on the board too ( it corrodes
> copper) and had to be laboriously scraped off.
>
> Are the dickheads who squirt this horrible goop all over PCBs NEVER
> going to wake up ??
>
>
>
> ..... Phil

Yup been there in the past 30 some years. Lots of Chinese VCR SMPS. I
reckon that crap is a moisture trap that eventually leads to the demise
of chokes, coils etc..

--
Live Fast Die Young, Leave A Pretty Corpse

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Aug 31 2011 9:14 pm
From: Alien

Meat Plow <mhywattt@yahoo.com> wrote in
<news:4vj1gf.h7s.17.1@news.alt.net>:

> On Wed, 31 Aug 2011 10:59:58 +1000, Phil Allison wrote:
>
>> ** I had hoped that the dreaded Yellow Glue peril had gone away - but it
>> is still with us.
>>
>> Most of you will have seen it holding parts down to PCBs on Asian made
>> equipment and many of those will have seen what happens if the parts
>> involved get hot.
>>
>> The example on my bench is the SMPS from an Alesis powered monitor ( M1
>> Active, Chinese made) ) which has blown up big time because of the damn
>> Yellow Glue used to secure a ferrite toroidal coil. All the glue used
>> had gone brown or back ( ie carbonised ) on this coil and arced across
>> nearby tracks taking out the main switching MOSFET, its drive IC and
>> associated transistors, high speed diodes and even the AC bridge
>> rectifier diodes.
>>
>> The toroidal coil had to be un-wound, cleaned up and re-wound. The same
>> glue was attacking parts elsewhere on the board too ( it corrodes
>> copper) and had to be laboriously scraped off.
>>
>> Are the dickheads who squirt this horrible goop all over PCBs NEVER
>> going to wake up ??
>>
>> ..... Phil
>
> Yup been there in the past 30 some years. Lots of Chinese VCR SMPS. I
> reckon that crap is a moisture trap that eventually leads to the demise
> of chokes, coils etc..

Aw, geez.

<smacks forehead>

It's not a 'moisture trap', you freaking retarded dildo muncher.

The glue gets carbonized due to excessive heat in the electrical
components, which makes the glue more conductive and more corrosive
(ie: it chemically changes the glue).

This causes havoc due to shorts (because it's conductive) and open
circuits (because it corrodes away circuit traces and component
leads).

Gawd but yer stupid.

'moisture trap'! Bwahahahaha!!!

> --
> Live Fat Die Broke, Leave A Pustulent Corpse

Fixed yer .sig., stupid.

Yer welcome.

'moisture trap' <snigger>

The only 'moisture trap' is yer ass, and the only 'moisture' it
'traps' is the spooge of a thousand gay bikers, you old fat ugly
retard.

--
___ ___ ___ ___
/\ \ /\__\ ___ /\ \ /\__\
/::\ \ /:/ / /\ \ /::\ \ /::| |
/:/\:\ \ /:/ / \:\ \ /:/\:\ \ /:|:| |
/::\~\:\ \ /:/ / /::\__\ /::\~\:\ \ /:/|:| |__
/:/\:\ \:\__\ /:/__/ __/:/\/__/ /:/\:\ \:\__\ /:/ |:| /\__\
\/__\:\/:/ / \:\ \ /\/:/ / \:\~\:\ \/__/ \/__|:|/:/ /
\::/ / \:\ \ \::/__/ \:\ \:\__\ |:/:/ /
/:/ / \:\ \ \:\__\ \:\ \/__/ |::/ /
/:/ / \:\__\ \/__/ \:\__\ /:/ /
\/__/ \/__/ \/__/ \/__/

WHO IS 'MEAT PLOW' from Alt.Usenet.Kooks (AUK)?

The obese, abusive, ugly, snaggle-toothed, giant-headed, stalking, gay
'bear' biker retard who likes to surf gay porn sites as 'BlancoBear'
while wearing only assless chaps:

William Malone Griffith, Jr.
(aka Milt, Meat Plow, BlancoBear, Meat@petitmorte.net, Tripp)
308 10th Street NE
North Canton, OH 44720-2023

Some of this sick fuck's best work, and comments from others about
him:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.buzzard.rules/msg/f630759d6303a19d
Message-ID: <SFexc.17128428$Of.2846155@news.easynews.com>

Meat Plow on a stalking holiday excursion, 15 to 22 Aug 2011:
--------------------
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.usenet.kooks/msg/03314ab006d88a5f
Message-ID: <4thf24.t7m.17.1@news.alt.net>
Date 06 Aug 2011
Title: Guess who is going to be in West Palm Beach?
"ME! Got a couple friends who invited me down for a few days. Shit
that's only 60 miles south of Melbourne LMAO!"

Nevermind that West Palm Beach, FL is 110 miles (not 60 miles) from
Melbourne, FL.

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.usenet.kooks/msg/c1438fbeda11457f
Message-ID: <4thnmr.t7m.17.5@news.alt.net>
Date 06 Aug 2011
Title: Guess who is going to be in West Palm Beach?
"Got my itinerary set on Expidia. Will be at PBI on August the 15th
at 11:30 am. Got a nice 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee reserved. I'm hoping
to make it up to Melbourne (Albatross hit my email) before the 20th
when I have to return."

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.usenet.kooks/msg/43855b424693fa60
Message-ID:
<349880291335311102.312349mhywattt-yahoo.com@news.altopia.com>
Date 17 Aug 2011
Title: MEAT-PLOW LIED AGAIN! (and gets smacked down YET AGAIN!)
"I have several videos and pictures of him riding and what I'm sure
pie the location of his tent."

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.usenet.kooks/msg/19e83b3eb6233fe2
Message-ID: <4uovsb.19t.17.3@news.alt.net>
Date 21 Aug 2011
Title: Emmy takes the day off.
"Well I leave tomorrow at around 7:am. Got some nice video and still
pix of the little shitty pants. There will be another Youtube video
soon"

Hmmm... only one and a half days 'visiting friends in West Palm Beach'
(if he was ever there to begin with), and the rest of his time in
Florida spent real-life stalking. He even extended his stay by two
days, so he could get in more stalking.
--------------------

Evidence that Meat Plow is William Malone Griffith, II:
--------------------
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.usenet.kooks/msg/5650f8e1e7dedefa
Message-ID: <fc5167ee7ad8e6f64bbe528026c00d98@rip.ax.lt>

http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/msg/e52ffbb346f5b764
Message-ID: <ac995ab01f76a177f4012486eb671c0e@rip.ax.lt>

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.usenet.kooks/msg/a94a2a11df601e39
Message-ID: <f6ccd46e74bff6e99d49781388db38c7@rip.ax.lt>

http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/msg/ef80aad2e7db945d
Message-ID: <2abe74de52d65b6046cc0bdd3c108d86@rip.ax.lt>
--------------------

Meat Plow personal info:
--------------------
Birthdate: Oct 3, 1955

Amateur Radio callsign N8NCX
Technician Plus
(2 meter, 6 meter)
--------------------

--------------------
Photo of MeatPlow in Belden Village Music store (his sister's music
store):
(Note the guitars in the background, the planet-sized head,
the rotten-Chiclet teeth, and general look of retardation)
http://www.productwiki.com/william-malone-griffith-ii/lists/
http://images.productwiki.com/upload/images/william_malone_griffith_ii_avatar_1_0-150-150.jpg

Photo of William Malone Griffith, Jr. from uffnet.com:
(Note that it's the same person as in the photo above)
http://www.uffnet.com/library/headlines/images/news1376621745xlb.jpg

He's got his father's nose and eyes:
http://www.legacy.com/guestbook/kentucky/guestbook.aspx?pid=2527782
http://mi-cache.legacy.com/usercontent/guestbook/photos/2005-09/6966764.jpg
--------------------

Meat Plow email addresses:
--------------------
http://web.archive.org/web/20010305113423/http://www.k1hk.org/ugb_archive3.html
"Bill N8NCX wgriffit@neo.rr.com"

wgriffit at neo.rr.com (neo = North East Ohio)
mhywattt at yahoo.com
mhywatt at yahoo.com
--------------------

Meat Plow's brushes with the law:
--------------------
1}
http://www.starkcountycjis.org/crim/crim_display_docket_main?pass_case_no=11543&pass_case_type=VBD&pass_case_year=2002&pass_first_name=William&pass_last_name=Griffith

2}
http://www.starkcountycjis.org/civil/civil_display_docket_main?case_year_no=2009-3533&litigant_txt=Griffith
--------------------

Meat Plow quotes:
--------------------
Meat Plow, explaining that his computer has no Master Boot Record
because he runs Mandriva 2010, not Windows:
Message-ID: <4v39g0.au.17.9@news.alt.net>
"Wouldn't know, it's been months since I've booted a Windoze OS."

Meat Plow describes his high-powered legal team:
Message-ID: <pan.2011.05.25.00.08.32@emutt.macspoofer.lmao>
"You know i have a legal team who specializes in internet law. And I
won't hesitate to get them in on the action."

Meat Plow losing his connection to reality, insinuating that he's law
enforcement:
Message-ID: <pan.2011.07.02.00.58.38@emutt.macspoofer.lmao>
"I could be LE posing as Meat Plow. It can't be dis-proven."

Meat Plow visits a massage parlor for a Happy Ending massage.
But they refused to give him a Happy Ending his second time there.
That explains why he's gay, he's so repulsive that he can't even PAY
for HAND JOBS from women.

http://www.clreviews.com/forums/showpost.php?p=11679
"One time I got a HE, and the 2nd time I didn't. I was asked if I was
there both times and said I was. That's is why I didn't know if I said
something wrong the 2nd time which made me not get a HE."

Well, at least we know what he does with his weekends.
--------------------

Oh, William, what would yer family say if they learned yer secrets?

Mother:
----------------------------.
Catherine & Angelo Griffith

4760 Echovalley St. NW
North Canton, OH 44720-7504
330-494-5785
'----------------------------'

Daughter:
----------------------------.
Julia M. Griffith

308 10th Street NE
North Canton, OH 44720-2023
'----------------------------'

Sister:
----------------------------------------.
Pamela L. & Roger R. Werling
{ son Todd E. Werling (Ft. Wayne, IN) }
{ son Chris (Kennesaw, GA) }
{ son Keith (Ft. Wayne, IN) }
{ grandson Easton }
{ grandson Zakary }
{ granddaughter Camella }

7704 Bisque Court
Fort Wayne, IN 46825-3501
260-489-6086
'----------------------------------------'

Sister:
----------------------------------------------.
Cheryl J. & Jason 'Sparky' Humberto E. Rivera
{ daughter Christina }
{ daughter Rosalio (North Canton, OH) }
{ daughter Maria (North Canton, OH) }
{ son Len Gray (Ft. Worth, TX) }

5225 Echo Valley St. NW
North Canton, OH 44720-9702
----------------------------------------------
Belden Village Music Store
6787 Wales Ave NW
North Canton, OH 44720
beldenvillagemusic.com
330-497-9292
----------------------------------------------
Rosalio B & Maria I Rivera
444 Wales Rd. NE
Massillon, OH 44646-5875
330-833-4291
----------------------------------------------
PO Box 35093
Canton, OH 44735
'----------------------------------------------'

Sister:
---------------------------------------.
Carol L. & Ric A. Campbell
{ son Richard }
{ son Christopher (North Canton, OH) }
{ son Brandon († 30 May 1996) }
{ daughter Erin }

6794 William Tell Ave NW
North Canton, OH 44720-6546
330-497-7980
330-499-5107
---------------------------------------
PO Box 36473
Canton, OH 44735
'---------------------------------------'

Sister:
----------------------------------.
Christine H. & Shelton M. Vick
{ son Matthew }

3915 Harvard Ave NW
Canton, OH 44709-1538
330-493-5645
----------------------------------
Re/Max Edge Realty
North Canton / Massillon / Canton
Realtor Christine H. Vick

6929 Portage St. NW
North Canton, OH 44720-6535
330-236-5100
888-830-6509 (fax)
330-904-0883 (cell)
www.MyOhioHomeFinder.com
MyOhioHomeFinder@gmail.com
'----------------------------------'

Sister:
----------------------------.
Angela C. & Mark Warshefski

11 SE 12th St.
Pompano Beach, FL 33060
954-785-4716
----------------------------
4760 Echovalley St. NW
North Canton, OH 44720-7504
330-942-0584
'----------------------------'

Cousin:
-------------------------.
Eddy Dailey

Bergholz Super Mart
861 Washington St.
Bergholz, OH 43908
740-768-1018
-------------------------
Bergholz Financial Corp.
dba SuperMart
PO Box 545
524 Garfield St.
Bergholz, OH 43908
'-------------------------'

Cousin:
--------------------.
Donna L. Dailey

524 5th St.
Bergholz, OH 43908
740-768-2416
--------------------
Bergholz Super Mart
861 Washington St.
Bergholz, OH 43908
740-768-1018
--------------------
Bergholz, OH EMT
'--------------------'

Cousin:
-------------------.
Bill & Joyce Leas
{ son Billy }

243 2nd St.
Bergholz, OH 43908
'-------------------'

Niece:
---------------------------.
Rachel & Adam T. Livengood
{ son Lukas }
{ daughter Lauren }

6342 Palmer Dr. NW
Canton, OH 44718
330-497-7754
'---------------------------'

Izzatchoo, or yer dead daddy?
--------------------------------.
William M. Griffith

between 3rd and 4th St.
between Monroe and Lincoln Ave.
Bergholz, OH 43908
740-768-2539
'--------------------------------'

What would yer landlord for 308 10th St. NE,
North Canton, OH say if they learned yer secrets?
----------------------------.
David S. and Joan R. Shaner

2095 Waterbury Dr.
Uniontown OH 44312
330-699-4042
'----------------------------'

What would the employees at yer family's
business say if they learned yer secrets?
-----------------------------------------.
Ohio Kentucky Oil Corporation
aka Ohio Oil & Gas Exploration (defunct)
aka Ohio Kentucky Coal Company (defunct)

5112 Portage St. NW
Canton, OH 44720-6856
(330) 494-8810
(330) 497-7980
-----------------------------------------
110 E. Lowry Lane
Lexington, KY 40503
(800) BUY 4 OIL
(800) 289-4645
(859) 223-5656
(859) 223-5946
(859) 276-0699 (fax)
(859) 276-3500
(859) 276-4080
-----------------------------------------
http://www.ohiokentuckyoil.com
oilstrike@insightbb.com
admin@ohiokentuckyoil.net
'-----------------------------------------'

----------
Oh, but wait, Ohio Oil & Gas Exploration is no longer incorporated in
Ohio:
Daddy Griffith's petrol exploration company (defunct):
http://www2.sos.state.oh.us/pls/bsqry/f?p=100:7:3376481605987832::NO:7:P7_CHARTER_NUM:384125

Nor are any of the other businesses yer daddy started. You let them
all fail:
Daddy Griffith's stables (defunct):
http://www2.sos.state.oh.us/pls/bsqry/f?p=100:7:3376481605987832::NO:7:P7_CHARTER_NUM:377966

Daddy Griffith's motel business (defunct):
http://www2.sos.state.oh.us/pls/bsqry/f?p=100:7:3376481605987832::NO:7:P7_CHARTER_NUM:377965

Daddy Griffith's drilling company (defunct):
http://www2.sos.state.oh.us/pls/bsqry/f?p=100:7:3376481605987832::NO:7:P7_CHARTER_NUM:347837

Daddy Griffith's metals business (defunct):
http://www2.sos.state.oh.us/pls/bsqry/f?p=100:7:3376481605987832::NO:7:P7_CHARTER_NUM:552193

And Ohio Kentucky Oil Corporation is on its last legs, inundated with
securities fraud lawsuits and EPA lawsuits. It's barred from
soliciting investors in Tennessee due to securities fraud, it's under
investigation in Ohio and Kentucky, it owns no oil assets or wells,
and it no longer does any of its own drilling. It'll be gone soon,
too.

And you've squandered everything Daddy Griffith earned from his
businesses, so yer now poor, adding insult to injury.
----------

You being poor is why you issued the following. You knew you didn't
have ten thousand dollars or so to defend yerself against yet another
lawsuit:

William Malone Griffith, II's grovelfest of an apology for being a
fucktard stauker:
==================================================
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.usenet.kooks/browse_thread/thread/8d753c94bd612f4e
http://www.freak-search.com/en/thread/3859383/meat_plow_exposed
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.usenet.kooks/msg/c9fccf0d1ab26ace
Message-ID: <3n4c2e.bi4.17.1@news.alt.net>

Title: Apology to Charles Novins

The witnesses to this abject, groveling apology:

Angela Griffith = Angela C. Griffith-Warshefski, William Malone
Griffith, Jr.'s sister

Catherine Griffith = William Malone Griffith, Jr.'s mother

Julia M. Griffith = William Malone Griffith, Jr.'s daughter

Cheri Griffith = Cheryl J. Griffith-Rivera, William Malone Griffith,
Jr.'s sister

Justin M. Griffith = ?

Kristy Griffith = Christine H. Griffith-Vick, William Malone Griffith,
Jr.'s sister
-----
Questions yet to be answered:
Who is Justin M. Griffith?

Angela C. Griffith-Warshefski came all the way from Pompano Beach,
Florida to witness and sign MeatPlow's apology letter?

Or did William Malone Griffith, Jr. forge the witness signatures,
which would indicate some level of insincerity in the apology?

If William Malone Griffith, Jr. did indeed forge the witness
signatures, is his family cognizant of him using them in this way?

Who is Deborah Ann Griffith?
-----
Who is Sherri Renee Christie, William D. Christie (age 54) and Lillie
L. Christie, and how are they associated with William Malone Griffith,
II?

1345 Bison St. NW
Massillon, OH 44647
330-833-5313 (Sherri)
330-837-4967 (William)

2524 Meadows Ave NW
Apt. 4
Massillon, OH 44647

PO Box 36221
Canton, OH 44735
-----
==================================================
It's time for a digital enema to flush this turd named William Malone
Griffith, II out of the system.

The exit is -.
|
'-----.
.---. .-----. |
| | '---. | |
'-. `-----|-' |
| '---'
'------------->
thataway

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Aug 31 2011 9:33 pm
From: "Phil Allison"

"Alien"

> It's not a 'moisture trap',
>
> The glue gets carbonized due to excessive heat in the electrical
> components, which makes the glue more conductive and more corrosive
> (ie: it chemically changes the glue).
>
> This causes havoc due to shorts (because it's conductive) and open
> circuits (because it corrodes away circuit traces and component
> leads).

** Correct.

The worst problems are always with gear that runs 24/7.

No chance for moisture ingress there.

.... Phil

==============================================================================
TOPIC: t.v. volume remains static.
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/8fbadf0c35306061?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Aug 31 2011 9:16 pm
From: jango2

On Aug 29, 9:55 am, delroy_dob...@yahoo.com wrote:
>  Panasonic t.v., TC 20RA10LP.I replaced the audio ic ,an7523n,and the
> t.v
>  now has sound but the sound/volume remains at one pitch.  whenever I
> press
>  the volume button whether up/down the volume remains same but
> whenever it
>  reaches 0 on the volume display on the screen you won't hear the
> volume.
>  what is wrong here ?
>   N:B  There is no bridges across the ic pins.

Look for a voltage variation on pin 9(DC VOL) as you turn volume up
and down. The new IC seems to be working else it wouldn't mute at
volume zero.
Google groupers have brains too.
Jango

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Motor start/stop switch with integrated mini contactor?
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/13b233689d902984?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Wed, Aug 31 2011 10:51 pm
From: "Michael A. Terrell"

"krw@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz" wrote:
>
> On Tue, 30 Aug 2011 18:18:28 -0700 (PDT), The Ghost In The Machine
> <proteusiiv@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >On Aug 30, 4:03 pm, "k...@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz"
> ><k...@att.bizzzzzzzzzzzz> wrote:
> >> On Tue, 30 Aug 2011 12:18:02 -0700, DaveC <inva...@invalid.net> wrote:
> >> >The only Telemecanique products I've been able to find are full-size magnetic
> >> >starters (contactors).
> >>
> >> Ignore the troll.
> >>
> >> >I'm looking for a manual start/stop switch with 2-pole contactor built-in.
> >> >Pressing the start button manually closes the contacts and energizes a coil,
> >> >which holds the contacts closed. Power fail opens the contacts.
> >>
> >> >Small (micro!) is what I'm looking for. No larger than the size of a
> >> >start/stop switch without contactor.
> >>
> >> These are sometimes called "magnetic start switches" and are commonly found on
> >> larger woodworking tools. I don't know if they're small enough for you but:http://www.grizzly.com/search/search.aspx?q=power%20switch
> >
> >........SHUT UP ASS DROOL.......I OWED YOU THAT!
> >AS FOR A P/N DAVE I DO NOT WORK FOR THEM...CONTACT THE CO's I
> >PROVIDED...THEY COME HIGHLY RECOMMENED FOR SWITCHES ETC.
> >WHATS NEXT?
> > COME OVER & INSTALL IT? BOOWAHAHAHAHA, NO WAY JOSÈ!
> >I AM A GHOST AND DO NOT DO MANUAL LABOR, BUT MAYBE KRAWFISHRW IS
> >WILLING TO COMPLETE THE JOB FOR YOU.
> > ASK HIS SQUALID ASS TO HELP YOU GET IT & HELP US KEEP THE INTERNET
> >FOOL FREE, ITS A GOOD COMBO.
> >ANYTIME OF THE VIRTUAL NIGHT OR DAY.
> >++BEST WISHES++
>
> At least DaveC now knows what you are.
>
> >PATECUM
>
> Still eating that stuff Queerjano.
>
> >TGITM
>
> I told you a long time ago, Queerjano, penicillin will do wonders for that.

Not anymore. They even made a movie about him and all that pus.

--
You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense.

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