Digest for sci.electronics.repair@googlegroups.com - 25 updates in 4 topics

2:44 AM Penedão
Amanda Riphnykhazova <licensedtoquill@gmail.com>: Jul 14 03:23PM -0700

Thanks for that
 
This was the sort of reason I wanted to change over the bulbs to LED. It should stress the wires and transformers less.
 
I know the chinese are mass producing m/billions of these mini-circuits for use in the bulbs. I just dont know what they do yet (or which no-name bulbs utilise which circuits): Do they make the bulbs more receptive to DC or rectify the current in some way to compensate for the lower draw?
 
But it is becoming exceptionally annoying changing these bulbs/transformers all the time. I currently have seven transformers in the strip and 3 are burned ouT! I suppose I would do anything at this point to change them!
Baron <baron@linuxmaniac.net>: Jul 15 07:23AM +0100

Amanda Riphnykhazova prodded the keyboard with:
 
> bulbs/transformers all the time. I currently have seven
> transformers in the strip and 3 are burned ouT! I suppose I would
> do anything at this point to change them!
 
Those transformers are actually high frequency inverters, about 200Khz
output or there abouts. They actually feed the halogen bulb with the
HF AC. You might find that the 12V MR16 LED doesn't like being fed
from them.
 
I made the decision to just remove them and feed the replacement LED's
straight from the 50Hz 240V mains. Changing the bulb holders wasn't
a downside because of the heat damage to the wires, though the actual
connector to the transformer was fine. So it was just a matter of
loosening the terminals and transferring the wires from the mains to
the new terminal block, the GU10 bulb holder was already wired into
the other side.
 
All the new bulbs have 12 SM LED's and are cold white and because the
kitchen and bathroom has a white colour scheme seem much brighter
than the old halogen bulbs. So much so that we now tend to turn on
only half of the 12 lights in the kitchen. The bathroom uses all
six.
 
 
--
Best Regards:
Baron.
"Danny D." <dannydiamico@yahoo.com>: Jul 15 01:10AM

On Wed, 13 Jul 2016 07:53:43 -0400, Stormin Mormon wrote:
 
> When you go back and answer my question,
> I'll consider answer yours.
 
As you know, I don't read every thread here.
I just read the threads that I author.
 
And I respond to EVERY valid question and point.
You know this because I have done this for years.
 
I just went (again) through each of the two dozen posts you made in this
thread, and I don't see any suggestion that I didn't already do on my own,
nor any question that is unanswered.
 
Since I prove everything I say, below are the two dozen posts from you in
this thread.
 
a. Where is a suggestion that I didn't try?
b. Where is there a question I didn't answer?
======================================================================
On 7/8/2016 7:22 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> to the touch - but the coils are not.
 
> I think the solenoid at the compressor "bulb" is what is making the noise.
> Any debugging advice?
 
Sounds just exactly like a bad start relay
on the compressor. This is considered "sealed
system". If you have the owners manual, see
how long is the sealed system warranty. Probably
five years, so you're out of warranty.
 
If it's out of warranty, are you any good with
electrical repairs? Please write back, and we'll
continue the discussion.
======================================================================
On 7/8/2016 8:31 PM, tom wrote:
 
> I would add that you should unplug the unit until you figure out what is
> wrong. In the current condition the OC protection is greatly stressed and
> will not last long.
 
You are so, so right. The compressor will
eventually over heat and might burn out.
 
Thank you, well said.
======================================================================
On 7/8/2016 8:49 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> F28/F11 which meant the motor control board was fried.
 
> Before that, it was a non-operational furnace (bad thermistor), and before
> that there were a host of things, most of which are working just fine now.
 
CY: Glad to be some help. Any time (well, figuratively speaking).
 
> liquid creates heat which is blown off by the fan - but I don't know the
> mechanics of what I should expect (e.g., what pumps the fluid/gas through
> the system? Gravity?).
 
CY: The big black thing in the back is a compressor.
> a. Motor
> b. Compressor
> c. Solenoid
 
CY: No, the motor and compressor are inside. The start relay (and some
have a relay and a capacitor) outside the sealed unit. The relay and cap
should never contact refrigerant. That said, the company probably
considers the relay and cap to be part of the sealed system.
 
 
> 1. Is the sealed unit a replaceable part?
> http://i.cubeupload.com/wAX37P.jpg (same pic as before)
 
CY: Yes. Though, it's often not cost effective. Requires refrigerant
pump, brazing, electrical, and more than that. Takes about three hours.
 
 
> 2. Why would the top of the black sealed unit be hot to the touch?
 
CY: The black sealed unit contains electric windings for the motor. The
unit keeps trying to start the compressor. Amp draw, turns the electric
watts into heat.
 
 
> 3. Is there a motor overheat safety switch that may have tripped?
 
CY: Yes, that combination amp and temp safety switch is what gives you
the repeated hum click.
 
 
> 4. Are those black coils in the bottom supposed to be warm or cold?
> http://i.cubeupload.com/jgkVXv.jpg (same pic as before)
CY: When the refrig is running, warm. They should NEVER get cold.
 
> OUTSIDE of the sealed unit (it may be translating from inside though). What
> is the purpose of that solenoid on the outside of the sealed unit?
> http://i.cubeupload.com/p2OiCZ.jpg (same pic as before)
 
CY: The compressor has two windings. Start, and run. The relay supplies
power to the start winding, and then later power to the run winding.
 
> In an hour or so, when the "sealed unit" has cooled down, I'll plug it back
> in and report back.
 
CY: I'm guessing it will do exactly the same hum click routine.
It's late on the east coast, I'm going to bed.
======================================================================
On 7/8/2016 8:49 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> In an hour or so, when the "sealed unit" has cooled down, I'll plug it back
> in and report back.
 
As a Kenmore, you may be able to buy OEM parts, but
if it were my unit, I'd use a universal hard start
kit. Seeing as how I carry them in my vehicle and
use the universal kits at work.
======================================================================
On 7/8/2016 9:26 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> Neither would budge.
> Have you removed them before?
 
> Is there a trick to removing them?
 
To keep these parts from coming off.
 
Pull straight out from compressor. Might need to
pry with slotted screw driver. Wiggle them back
and forth while pulling.
======================================================================
On 7/8/2016 10:40 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> Is it even possible for a homeowner to replace the compressor #28?
 
No. Sorry, but that takes a lot of skills
that the average HO does not have.
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 1:27 AM, Danny D. wrote:
> b) relay, or
> c) new frig?
 
> Any idea how to test the relay?
 
d) the suggestion Stormy gave yesterday.
 
I've never tested a relay. Just replace,
and see if the unit comes back to life.
 
You may also answer my question, if you wish.
The one I asked yesterday.
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 12:29 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> http://i.cubeupload.com/ewhAUP.jpg
 
> The "courage" here is better than a shot of whiskey because you give me the
> confidence that I just need to try harder! :)
 
And, won't prevent you from being a Mormon.
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 12:49 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> On Sat, 9 Jul 2016 12:41:11 -0400, Stormin Mormon wrote:
 
>> And, won't prevent you from being a Mormon.
 
> If I become a Mormon, do I have to tell my Italian wife?
 
CY: Yes, many Italians are Mormons.
 
> Maybe I'll make a deal with her:
> Mormon for the refrigerator?
 
CY: She'll love it!
 
> PS: Is polygamy still allowed?
 
CY: Not since 1890.
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 12:47 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> it in a few times. Here is a video of what happened.
> http://tinypic.com/r/20ubk3d/9
 
> Can anyone tell, from that video, what is happening?
 
Yes. I can. Totally what I diagnosed yesterday.
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 6:50 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> He really talked me out of buying both parts. They were each about 50
> bucks, and he said I'd just be unhappy. So he sent me home to do some more
> diagnostics with a test cable, which I'm gonna make now.
 
Danny, are my posts making it through your server?
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 6:48 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> 5. Yank off the start wire as soon as the compressor starts
 
> If the compressor starts, then it's good.
> If not ...
 
Danny, are my posts making it to you,
through your server? You've not answered
my question. And you're going through a
lot of bother which isn't really needed.
 
But, did you ever do any thing simple?
 
I leave you to your complications.
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 6:48 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> 5. Yank off the start wire as soon as the compressor starts
 
> If the compressor starts, then it's good.
> If not ...
 
Danny, are my posts making it to you, through your server?
You've not answered my question.
And you're going through a lot of bother which isn't really needed.
But, did you ever do any thing simple?
I leave you to your complications.
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 3:22 PM, Danny D. wrote:
>> piston.
 
> I don't know any other way to test for "mechanical" operation of the
> compressor.
 
Pump out all the refrigerant.
Saw the top off the compressor.
After the inspection, weld the compressor using a gas tight "bead" of weld.
Replace the refrigerant.
 
No problem for you, right?
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 5:26 PM, tom wrote:
> There are "hard start" compressor starters available that might be worth
> looking at.
 
Don't bother. I suggested that a week ago,
and Danny totally ignored me. And ignored
my hints and reminders.
 
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 7:08 PM, Bob Engelhardt wrote:
>> my hints and reminders.
 
> Actually, I don't think that you did. You probably meant to, but were
> too pissed from his ignoring you.
 
Think I remember at least one reminder. Well,
moot point. He's gone so far afield on so many
directions, there's no contacting him, now.
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 10:57 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> I think I tried *every* suggestion ever made in this thread.
 
> Here's yours, but I don't remember it being suggested until today.
> http://i.cubeupload.com/ja5XaK.jpg
 
You never answered my question, and I never
made any suggestions what to do. Other than
suggesting you answer my question so we can
move on.
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 10:47 PM, Danny D. wrote:
>> my hints and reminders.
 
> You mean this?
> http://i.cubeupload.com/VD0haS.jp
 
"not found" is what the web page says.
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 10:47 PM, Danny D. wrote:
>> my hints and reminders.
 
> You mean this?
> http://i.cubeupload.com/VD0haS.jpg
 
I added a g to the end of the URL, and got
a picture. I can't comment on that, until
you answer my question.
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 11:21 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> How do you respond so quickly?
 
> I have to sit down at the computer to even see a message, so, I don't see
> them in real time. Do you have something that goes to your phone?
 
Coincidence. I'm on the east coast, and
spend a bit of time on the computer in
the evenings.
 
What question? I only asked twice.
======================================================================
On 7/13/2016 12:56 AM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> Is it OK to have the frig temporarily on two power cords?
> a. One for the fan and the rest of the frig
> b. One just for the compressor
 
If you'd done what I said, and played along,
this could have been fixed last week. Hope
you are enjoying your self.
 
======================================================================
On 7/13/2016 1:09 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> The 1/2-to-1/3HP hard-start cap isn't working.
 
> Half the time it starts the compressor, and half the time it does NOT start
> the compressor.
 
Yes, it's obvious that you don't see.
======================================================================
On 7/13/2016 10:00 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> I had never looked at the back of a frig in my life before.
> I ask you guys for help because the frig is a riddle to me.
> I don't need more riddles though.
 
When you run into a problem, you can either
do things differently, or force harder, using
the technique which has failed up to that point.
 
I offered you (repeatedly) a chance to do
differently, and you ignored me repeatedly.
This post is an example of trying to force
your failing techniques even harder, and
trying to force me to participate with your
failings. I'll have you know, that I viewed
NONE of the links, and barely read your text.
 
By way of references, I've been working on
domstic refrigerators for over 10 years. I'm
fairly sure that if you'd done what I said,
it would have been fixed several days ago.
I'm also fairly sure I know why your compressor
keeps going off.
======================================================================
On 7/14/2016 2:01 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> I answered *every* single question that people, including you, asked.
 
Nope. And, I asked twice.
======================================================================
On 7/14/2016 2:01 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> No more riddles please. Just straight talk.
> 1. What is your question?
> 2. What is your suggestion?
 
It's under this header, and also under
subject line of "Debug advice, and a
question for Danny D".
======================================================================
On 7/13/2016 2:02 AM, Danny D. wrote:
> I was throwing away the frig as of this morning, so, there was no need to
> clean the condenser coil. I guess I'll clean it now - although do you
> really thing *that* is what is making the compressor cycle?
 
When you go back and answer my question,
I'll consider answer yours.
======================================================================
======================================================================
"Danny D." <dannydiamico@yahoo.com>: Jul 15 01:10AM

On Thu, 14 Jul 2016 20:28:41 -0400, Stormin Mormon wrote:
 
 
> It's under this header, and also under
> subject line of "Debug advice, and a
> question for Danny D".
 
As you know, I don't read every thread here.
I just read the threads that I author.
 
And I respond to EVERY valid question and point.
You know this because I have done this for years.
 
I just went (again) through each of the two dozen posts you made in this
thread, and I don't see any suggestion that I didn't already do on my own,
nor any question that is unanswered.
 
Since I prove everything I say, below are the two dozen posts from you in
this thread.
 
a. Where is a suggestion that I didn't try?
b. Where is there a question I didn't answer?
======================================================================
On 7/8/2016 7:22 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> to the touch - but the coils are not.
 
> I think the solenoid at the compressor "bulb" is what is making the noise.
> Any debugging advice?
 
Sounds just exactly like a bad start relay
on the compressor. This is considered "sealed
system". If you have the owners manual, see
how long is the sealed system warranty. Probably
five years, so you're out of warranty.
 
If it's out of warranty, are you any good with
electrical repairs? Please write back, and we'll
continue the discussion.
======================================================================
On 7/8/2016 8:31 PM, tom wrote:
 
> I would add that you should unplug the unit until you figure out what is
> wrong. In the current condition the OC protection is greatly stressed and
> will not last long.
 
You are so, so right. The compressor will
eventually over heat and might burn out.
 
Thank you, well said.
======================================================================
On 7/8/2016 8:49 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> F28/F11 which meant the motor control board was fried.
 
> Before that, it was a non-operational furnace (bad thermistor), and before
> that there were a host of things, most of which are working just fine now.
 
CY: Glad to be some help. Any time (well, figuratively speaking).
 
> liquid creates heat which is blown off by the fan - but I don't know the
> mechanics of what I should expect (e.g., what pumps the fluid/gas through
> the system? Gravity?).
 
CY: The big black thing in the back is a compressor.
> a. Motor
> b. Compressor
> c. Solenoid
 
CY: No, the motor and compressor are inside. The start relay (and some
have a relay and a capacitor) outside the sealed unit. The relay and cap
should never contact refrigerant. That said, the company probably
considers the relay and cap to be part of the sealed system.
 
 
> 1. Is the sealed unit a replaceable part?
> http://i.cubeupload.com/wAX37P.jpg (same pic as before)
 
CY: Yes. Though, it's often not cost effective. Requires refrigerant
pump, brazing, electrical, and more than that. Takes about three hours.
 
 
> 2. Why would the top of the black sealed unit be hot to the touch?
 
CY: The black sealed unit contains electric windings for the motor. The
unit keeps trying to start the compressor. Amp draw, turns the electric
watts into heat.
 
 
> 3. Is there a motor overheat safety switch that may have tripped?
 
CY: Yes, that combination amp and temp safety switch is what gives you
the repeated hum click.
 
 
> 4. Are those black coils in the bottom supposed to be warm or cold?
> http://i.cubeupload.com/jgkVXv.jpg (same pic as before)
CY: When the refrig is running, warm. They should NEVER get cold.
 
> OUTSIDE of the sealed unit (it may be translating from inside though). What
> is the purpose of that solenoid on the outside of the sealed unit?
> http://i.cubeupload.com/p2OiCZ.jpg (same pic as before)
 
CY: The compressor has two windings. Start, and run. The relay supplies
power to the start winding, and then later power to the run winding.
 
> In an hour or so, when the "sealed unit" has cooled down, I'll plug it back
> in and report back.
 
CY: I'm guessing it will do exactly the same hum click routine.
It's late on the east coast, I'm going to bed.
======================================================================
On 7/8/2016 8:49 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> In an hour or so, when the "sealed unit" has cooled down, I'll plug it back
> in and report back.
 
As a Kenmore, you may be able to buy OEM parts, but
if it were my unit, I'd use a universal hard start
kit. Seeing as how I carry them in my vehicle and
use the universal kits at work.
======================================================================
On 7/8/2016 9:26 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> Neither would budge.
> Have you removed them before?
 
> Is there a trick to removing them?
 
To keep these parts from coming off.
 
Pull straight out from compressor. Might need to
pry with slotted screw driver. Wiggle them back
and forth while pulling.
======================================================================
On 7/8/2016 10:40 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> Is it even possible for a homeowner to replace the compressor #28?
 
No. Sorry, but that takes a lot of skills
that the average HO does not have.
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 1:27 AM, Danny D. wrote:
> b) relay, or
> c) new frig?
 
> Any idea how to test the relay?
 
d) the suggestion Stormy gave yesterday.
 
I've never tested a relay. Just replace,
and see if the unit comes back to life.
 
You may also answer my question, if you wish.
The one I asked yesterday.
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 12:29 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> http://i.cubeupload.com/ewhAUP.jpg
 
> The "courage" here is better than a shot of whiskey because you give me the
> confidence that I just need to try harder! :)
 
And, won't prevent you from being a Mormon.
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 12:49 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> On Sat, 9 Jul 2016 12:41:11 -0400, Stormin Mormon wrote:
 
>> And, won't prevent you from being a Mormon.
 
> If I become a Mormon, do I have to tell my Italian wife?
 
CY: Yes, many Italians are Mormons.
 
> Maybe I'll make a deal with her:
> Mormon for the refrigerator?
 
CY: She'll love it!
 
> PS: Is polygamy still allowed?
 
CY: Not since 1890.
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 12:47 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> it in a few times. Here is a video of what happened.
> http://tinypic.com/r/20ubk3d/9
 
> Can anyone tell, from that video, what is happening?
 
Yes. I can. Totally what I diagnosed yesterday.
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 6:50 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> He really talked me out of buying both parts. They were each about 50
> bucks, and he said I'd just be unhappy. So he sent me home to do some more
> diagnostics with a test cable, which I'm gonna make now.
 
Danny, are my posts making it through your server?
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 6:48 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> 5. Yank off the start wire as soon as the compressor starts
 
> If the compressor starts, then it's good.
> If not ...
 
Danny, are my posts making it to you,
through your server? You've not answered
my question. And you're going through a
lot of bother which isn't really needed.
 
But, did you ever do any thing simple?
 
I leave you to your complications.
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 6:48 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> 5. Yank off the start wire as soon as the compressor starts
 
> If the compressor starts, then it's good.
> If not ...
 
Danny, are my posts making it to you, through your server?
You've not answered my question.
And you're going through a lot of bother which isn't really needed.
But, did you ever do any thing simple?
I leave you to your complications.
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 3:22 PM, Danny D. wrote:
>> piston.
 
> I don't know any other way to test for "mechanical" operation of the
> compressor.
 
Pump out all the refrigerant.
Saw the top off the compressor.
After the inspection, weld the compressor using a gas tight "bead" of weld.
Replace the refrigerant.
 
No problem for you, right?
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 5:26 PM, tom wrote:
> There are "hard start" compressor starters available that might be worth
> looking at.
 
Don't bother. I suggested that a week ago,
and Danny totally ignored me. And ignored
my hints and reminders.
 
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 7:08 PM, Bob Engelhardt wrote:
>> my hints and reminders.
 
> Actually, I don't think that you did. You probably meant to, but were
> too pissed from his ignoring you.
 
Think I remember at least one reminder. Well,
moot point. He's gone so far afield on so many
directions, there's no contacting him, now.
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 10:57 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> I think I tried *every* suggestion ever made in this thread.
 
> Here's yours, but I don't remember it being suggested until today.
> http://i.cubeupload.com/ja5XaK.jpg
 
You never answered my question, and I never
made any suggestions what to do. Other than
suggesting you answer my question so we can
move on.
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 10:47 PM, Danny D. wrote:
>> my hints and reminders.
 
> You mean this?
> http://i.cubeupload.com/VD0haS.jp
 
"not found" is what the web page says.
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 10:47 PM, Danny D. wrote:
>> my hints and reminders.
 
> You mean this?
> http://i.cubeupload.com/VD0haS.jpg
 
I added a g to the end of the URL, and got
a picture. I can't comment on that, until
you answer my question.
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 11:21 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> How do you respond so quickly?
 
> I have to sit down at the computer to even see a message, so, I don't see
> them in real time. Do you have something that goes to your phone?
 
Coincidence. I'm on the east coast, and
spend a bit of time on the computer in
the evenings.
 
What question? I only asked twice.
======================================================================
On 7/13/2016 12:56 AM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> Is it OK to have the frig temporarily on two power cords?
> a. One for the fan and the rest of the frig
> b. One just for the compressor
 
If you'd done what I said, and played along,
this could have been fixed last week. Hope
you are enjoying your self.
 
======================================================================
On 7/13/2016 1:09 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> The 1/2-to-1/3HP hard-start cap isn't working.
 
> Half the time it starts the compressor, and half the time it does NOT start
> the compressor.
 
Yes, it's obvious that you don't see.
======================================================================
On 7/13/2016 10:00 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> I had never looked at the back of a frig in my life before.
> I ask you guys for help because the frig is a riddle to me.
> I don't need more riddles though.
 
When you run into a problem, you can either
do things differently, or force harder, using
the technique which has failed up to that point.
 
I offered you (repeatedly) a chance to do
differently, and you ignored me repeatedly.
This post is an example of trying to force
your failing techniques even harder, and
trying to force me to participate with your
failings. I'll have you know, that I viewed
NONE of the links, and barely read your text.
 
By way of references, I've been working on
domstic refrigerators for over 10 years. I'm
fairly sure that if you'd done what I said,
it would have been fixed several days ago.
I'm also fairly sure I know why your compressor
keeps going off.
======================================================================
On 7/14/2016 2:01 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> I answered *every* single question that people, including you, asked.
 
Nope. And, I asked twice.
======================================================================
On 7/14/2016 2:01 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> No more riddles please. Just straight talk.
> 1. What is your question?
> 2. What is your suggestion?
 
It's under this header, and also under
subject line of "Debug advice, and a
question for Danny D".
======================================================================
On 7/13/2016 2:02 AM, Danny D. wrote:
> I was throwing away the frig as of this morning, so, there was no need to
> clean the condenser coil. I guess I'll clean it now - although do you
> really thing *that* is what is making the compressor cycle?
 
When you go back and answer my question,
I'll consider answer yours.
======================================================================
======================================================================
"Danny D." <dannydiamico@yahoo.com>: Jul 15 01:18AM

On Sat, 9 Jul 2016 12:44:01 -0400, Stormin Mormon wrote:
 
> learn more about Jesus
> . www.lds.org
> .
 
As you know, I only come to alt.home.repair when I have a problem, and when
I author a thread, I read *everything* in the thread, supplying photos and
model numbers and references, etc.,
 
I never read any other threads.
I just don't.
 
You know that too, because I've never responded to a thread outside my
threads. (Well, sometimes I get Oren asking me to answer a post about
garage door springs...).
 
Anyway, since you asked this *outside* of the thread I authored, I didn't
see it until just now because I don't read this newsgroup. I only respond
*inside* the threads I author.
 
The machine is, as noted in the OP of that other thread, not under warranty
because Sears has a 1 year and 5 year warranty but the machine was bought
in 2010 (as noted in that OP) so the warranty expired last year.
 
As you know also from that OP, I have never even looked at a refrigerator;
however, as you may know from this forum, I've repaired my washing machine
(replacing the motor control board) and many times I've repaired my pool
pumps, and I've replaced my own garage door springs, etc., so, I'm as good
as anyone with electrical repairs.
 
I have a VOM and a DMM and I built test jigs and I took college physics and
chemistry and tons of other classes and I built my own class A amplifiers
when I was fifteen (Silicon Germanium) so I know all about capacitors
resistors diodes transistors, etc.. I've wired my own computers, and I've
written assembly language programs, and I've debugged basic appliances.
 
Having said that, I've never worked on a refrigerator before.
"Danny D." <dannydiamico@yahoo.com>: Jul 15 01:21AM

On Thu, 14 Jul 2016 20:32:09 -0400, Stormin Mormon wrote:
 
>>> Please write back, and we'llcontinue the discussion.
>> Not that Danny reads my posts, you see.
 
> Fourth time I've posted the question. Or maybe fifth time.
 
I author threads and read and respond to *every* post in the threads I
author.
I don't, as a rule, read the newsgroup, and never have.
 
I've been on this newsgroup for years, and I have been doing that for
years.
 
So I never looked *outside* the thread I authored (why would a question be
to me about the thread I authored but outside the thread I authored?).
 
Anyway, the machine is not in warranty and the first post of the thread I
authored showed that since it's a 5 year warranty at Sears and the machine
is 6 years old.
 
The warranty doesn't matter.
 
What matters is that the compressor doesn't start, and only started two or
three times when I put the hard-start capacitor on it.
 
I don't know what to make of that data point.
"Danny D." <dannydiamico@yahoo.com>: Jul 15 01:22AM

On Sat, 9 Jul 2016 20:23:36 +0100, Gareth Magennis wrote:
 
> Since you missed the question the first time.
 
Here are all the posts from you in the relevant thread.
I know of no questions you asked in that relevant thread that I didn't
answer.
And I know of no suggestions from you in that relevant thread that I
haven't already tried.
 
What I know is not there is an explanation of why the compressor might
start with the hard-start cap 2 out of 20 times.
 
It pulls 3 amps when it runs; 13.5 amps when it's locked.
The LRA is 17.6 amps.
 
What do you make of that?
 
--------------------------------
======================================================================
On 7/8/2016 7:22 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> to the touch - but the coils are not.
 
> I think the solenoid at the compressor "bulb" is what is making the noise.
> Any debugging advice?
 
Sounds just exactly like a bad start relay
on the compressor. This is considered "sealed
system". If you have the owners manual, see
how long is the sealed system warranty. Probably
five years, so you're out of warranty.
 
If it's out of warranty, are you any good with
electrical repairs? Please write back, and we'll
continue the discussion.
======================================================================
On 7/8/2016 8:31 PM, tom wrote:
 
> I would add that you should unplug the unit until you figure out what is
> wrong. In the current condition the OC protection is greatly stressed and
> will not last long.
 
You are so, so right. The compressor will
eventually over heat and might burn out.
 
Thank you, well said.
======================================================================
On 7/8/2016 8:49 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> F28/F11 which meant the motor control board was fried.
 
> Before that, it was a non-operational furnace (bad thermistor), and before
> that there were a host of things, most of which are working just fine now.
 
CY: Glad to be some help. Any time (well, figuratively speaking).
 
> liquid creates heat which is blown off by the fan - but I don't know the
> mechanics of what I should expect (e.g., what pumps the fluid/gas through
> the system? Gravity?).
 
CY: The big black thing in the back is a compressor.
> a. Motor
> b. Compressor
> c. Solenoid
 
CY: No, the motor and compressor are inside. The start relay (and some
have a relay and a capacitor) outside the sealed unit. The relay and cap
should never contact refrigerant. That said, the company probably
considers the relay and cap to be part of the sealed system.
 
 
> 1. Is the sealed unit a replaceable part?
> http://i.cubeupload.com/wAX37P.jpg (same pic as before)
 
CY: Yes. Though, it's often not cost effective. Requires refrigerant
pump, brazing, electrical, and more than that. Takes about three hours.
 
 
> 2. Why would the top of the black sealed unit be hot to the touch?
 
CY: The black sealed unit contains electric windings for the motor. The
unit keeps trying to start the compressor. Amp draw, turns the electric
watts into heat.
 
 
> 3. Is there a motor overheat safety switch that may have tripped?
 
CY: Yes, that combination amp and temp safety switch is what gives you
the repeated hum click.
 
 
> 4. Are those black coils in the bottom supposed to be warm or cold?
> http://i.cubeupload.com/jgkVXv.jpg (same pic as before)
CY: When the refrig is running, warm. They should NEVER get cold.
 
> OUTSIDE of the sealed unit (it may be translating from inside though). What
> is the purpose of that solenoid on the outside of the sealed unit?
> http://i.cubeupload.com/p2OiCZ.jpg (same pic as before)
 
CY: The compressor has two windings. Start, and run. The relay supplies
power to the start winding, and then later power to the run winding.
 
> In an hour or so, when the "sealed unit" has cooled down, I'll plug it back
> in and report back.
 
CY: I'm guessing it will do exactly the same hum click routine.
It's late on the east coast, I'm going to bed.
======================================================================
On 7/8/2016 8:49 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> In an hour or so, when the "sealed unit" has cooled down, I'll plug it back
> in and report back.
 
As a Kenmore, you may be able to buy OEM parts, but
if it were my unit, I'd use a universal hard start
kit. Seeing as how I carry them in my vehicle and
use the universal kits at work.
======================================================================
On 7/8/2016 9:26 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> Neither would budge.
> Have you removed them before?
 
> Is there a trick to removing them?
 
To keep these parts from coming off.
 
Pull straight out from compressor. Might need to
pry with slotted screw driver. Wiggle them back
and forth while pulling.
======================================================================
On 7/8/2016 10:40 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> Is it even possible for a homeowner to replace the compressor #28?
 
No. Sorry, but that takes a lot of skills
that the average HO does not have.
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 1:27 AM, Danny D. wrote:
> b) relay, or
> c) new frig?
 
> Any idea how to test the relay?
 
d) the suggestion Stormy gave yesterday.
 
I've never tested a relay. Just replace,
and see if the unit comes back to life.
 
You may also answer my question, if you wish.
The one I asked yesterday.
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 12:29 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> http://i.cubeupload.com/ewhAUP.jpg
 
> The "courage" here is better than a shot of whiskey because you give me the
> confidence that I just need to try harder! :)
 
And, won't prevent you from being a Mormon.
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 12:49 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> On Sat, 9 Jul 2016 12:41:11 -0400, Stormin Mormon wrote:
 
>> And, won't prevent you from being a Mormon.
 
> If I become a Mormon, do I have to tell my Italian wife?
 
CY: Yes, many Italians are Mormons.
 
> Maybe I'll make a deal with her:
> Mormon for the refrigerator?
 
CY: She'll love it!
 
> PS: Is polygamy still allowed?
 
CY: Not since 1890.
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 12:47 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> it in a few times. Here is a video of what happened.
> http://tinypic.com/r/20ubk3d/9
 
> Can anyone tell, from that video, what is happening?
 
Yes. I can. Totally what I diagnosed yesterday.
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 6:50 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> He really talked me out of buying both parts. They were each about 50
> bucks, and he said I'd just be unhappy. So he sent me home to do some more
> diagnostics with a test cable, which I'm gonna make now.
 
Danny, are my posts making it through your server?
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 6:48 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> 5. Yank off the start wire as soon as the compressor starts
 
> If the compressor starts, then it's good.
> If not ...
 
Danny, are my posts making it to you,
through your server? You've not answered
my question. And you're going through a
lot of bother which isn't really needed.
 
But, did you ever do any thing simple?
 
I leave you to your complications.
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 6:48 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> 5. Yank off the start wire as soon as the compressor starts
 
> If the compressor starts, then it's good.
> If not ...
 
Danny, are my posts making it to you, through your server?
You've not answered my question.
And you're going through a lot of bother which isn't really needed.
But, did you ever do any thing simple?
I leave you to your complications.
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 3:22 PM, Danny D. wrote:
>> piston.
 
> I don't know any other way to test for "mechanical" operation of the
> compressor.
 
Pump out all the refrigerant.
Saw the top off the compressor.
After the inspection, weld the compressor using a gas tight "bead" of weld.
Replace the refrigerant.
 
No problem for you, right?
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 5:26 PM, tom wrote:
> There are "hard start" compressor starters available that might be worth
> looking at.
 
Don't bother. I suggested that a week ago,
and Danny totally ignored me. And ignored
my hints and reminders.
 
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 7:08 PM, Bob Engelhardt wrote:
>> my hints and reminders.
 
> Actually, I don't think that you did. You probably meant to, but were
> too pissed from his ignoring you.
 
Think I remember at least one reminder. Well,
moot point. He's gone so far afield on so many
directions, there's no contacting him, now.
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 10:57 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> I think I tried *every* suggestion ever made in this thread.
 
> Here's yours, but I don't remember it being suggested until today.
> http://i.cubeupload.com/ja5XaK.jpg
 
You never answered my question, and I never
made any suggestions what to do. Other than
suggesting you answer my question so we can
move on.
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 10:47 PM, Danny D. wrote:
>> my hints and reminders.
 
> You mean this?
> http://i.cubeupload.com/VD0haS.jp
 
"not found" is what the web page says.
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 10:47 PM, Danny D. wrote:
>> my hints and reminders.
 
> You mean this?
> http://i.cubeupload.com/VD0haS.jpg
 
I added a g to the end of the URL, and got
a picture. I can't comment on that, until
you answer my question.
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 11:21 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> How do you respond so quickly?
 
> I have to sit down at the computer to even see a message, so, I don't see
> them in real time. Do you have something that goes to your phone?
 
Coincidence. I'm on the east coast, and
spend a bit of time on the computer in
the evenings.
 
What question? I only asked twice.
======================================================================
On 7/13/2016 12:56 AM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> Is it OK to have the frig temporarily on two power cords?
> a. One for the fan and the rest of the frig
> b. One just for the compressor
 
If you'd done what I said, and played along,
this could have been fixed last week. Hope
you are enjoying your self.
 
======================================================================
On 7/13/2016 1:09 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> The 1/2-to-1/3HP hard-start cap isn't working.
 
> Half the time it starts the compressor, and half the time it does NOT start
> the compressor.
 
Yes, it's obvious that you don't see.
======================================================================
On 7/13/2016 10:00 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> I had never looked at the back of a frig in my life before.
> I ask you guys for help because the frig is a riddle to me.
> I don't need more riddles though.
 
When you run into a problem, you can either
do things differently, or force harder, using
the technique which has failed up to that point.
 
I offered you (repeatedly) a chance to do
differently, and you ignored me repeatedly.
This post is an example of trying to force
your failing techniques even harder, and
trying to force me to participate with your
failings. I'll have you know, that I viewed
NONE of the links, and barely read your text.
 
By way of references, I've been working on
domstic refrigerators for over 10 years. I'm
fairly sure that if you'd done what I said,
it would have been fixed several days ago.
I'm also fairly sure I know why your compressor
keeps going off.
======================================================================
On 7/14/2016 2:01 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> I answered *every* single question that people, including you, asked.
 
Nope. And, I asked twice.
======================================================================
On 7/14/2016 2:01 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> No more riddles please. Just straight talk.
> 1. What is your question?
> 2. What is your suggestion?
 
It's under this header, and also under
subject line of "Debug advice, and a
question for Danny D".
======================================================================
On 7/13/2016 2:02 AM, Danny D. wrote:
> I was throwing away the frig as of this morning, so, there was no need to
> clean the condenser coil. I guess I'll clean it now - although do you
> really thing *that* is what is making the compressor cycle?
 
When you go back and answer my question,
I'll consider answer yours.
======================================================================
======================================================================
"Danny D." <dannydiamico@yahoo.com>: Jul 15 01:31AM

On Wed, 13 Jul 2016 07:52:43 -0400, Stormin Mormon wrote:
 
> I'm to the point where I glance at and delete the
> posts with little attention to what he's playing
> with.
 
There are pictures galore of me not only dusting off the compressor coils,
but also blowing 100psi compressed air, and even a story about how my
sister saw all the dust that came out streamed across the kitchen floor for
more than 10 feet.
 
There are also pictures of the coils very clean and they aren't and never
were the problem, simply because dusty coils can not cause a compressor not
to start. They can cause a compressor to work harder and overheat (simply
because they're not cooling - but they can't possibly cause a compressor
not to start).
 
As for picking and choosing, I read *all* posts in the threads that I
author, and I respond to all valid posts in the threads I author.
 
I have been doing this for years in this newsgroup, so you know this.
I also do not respond to threads that I don't author, which also you should
know by now (simply becuase I have almost never done it).
 
The only reason I even saw this thread is that SM said that he asked a
question and I tried to find what the heck he was talking about.
 
I still haven't found the question he says is unanswered, and even more
importantly, I still haven't found any suggestion from him that isn't what
I already did long ago.
 
Here are all the posts from him in that thread - none of which contain an
unanswered question or an untried suggestion.
======================================================================
On 7/8/2016 7:22 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> to the touch - but the coils are not.
 
> I think the solenoid at the compressor "bulb" is what is making the noise.
> Any debugging advice?
 
Sounds just exactly like a bad start relay
on the compressor. This is considered "sealed
system". If you have the owners manual, see
how long is the sealed system warranty. Probably
five years, so you're out of warranty.
 
If it's out of warranty, are you any good with
electrical repairs? Please write back, and we'll
continue the discussion.
======================================================================
On 7/8/2016 8:31 PM, tom wrote:
 
> I would add that you should unplug the unit until you figure out what is
> wrong. In the current condition the OC protection is greatly stressed and
> will not last long.
 
You are so, so right. The compressor will
eventually over heat and might burn out.
 
Thank you, well said.
======================================================================
On 7/8/2016 8:49 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> F28/F11 which meant the motor control board was fried.
 
> Before that, it was a non-operational furnace (bad thermistor), and before
> that there were a host of things, most of which are working just fine now.
 
CY: Glad to be some help. Any time (well, figuratively speaking).
 
> liquid creates heat which is blown off by the fan - but I don't know the
> mechanics of what I should expect (e.g., what pumps the fluid/gas through
> the system? Gravity?).
 
CY: The big black thing in the back is a compressor.
> a. Motor
> b. Compressor
> c. Solenoid
 
CY: No, the motor and compressor are inside. The start relay (and some
have a relay and a capacitor) outside the sealed unit. The relay and cap
should never contact refrigerant. That said, the company probably
considers the relay and cap to be part of the sealed system.
 
 
> 1. Is the sealed unit a replaceable part?
> http://i.cubeupload.com/wAX37P.jpg (same pic as before)
 
CY: Yes. Though, it's often not cost effective. Requires refrigerant
pump, brazing, electrical, and more than that. Takes about three hours.
 
 
> 2. Why would the top of the black sealed unit be hot to the touch?
 
CY: The black sealed unit contains electric windings for the motor. The
unit keeps trying to start the compressor. Amp draw, turns the electric
watts into heat.
 
 
> 3. Is there a motor overheat safety switch that may have tripped?
 
CY: Yes, that combination amp and temp safety switch is what gives you
the repeated hum click.
 
 
> 4. Are those black coils in the bottom supposed to be warm or cold?
> http://i.cubeupload.com/jgkVXv.jpg (same pic as before)
CY: When the refrig is running, warm. They should NEVER get cold.
 
> OUTSIDE of the sealed unit (it may be translating from inside though). What
> is the purpose of that solenoid on the outside of the sealed unit?
> http://i.cubeupload.com/p2OiCZ.jpg (same pic as before)
 
CY: The compressor has two windings. Start, and run. The relay supplies
power to the start winding, and then later power to the run winding.
 
> In an hour or so, when the "sealed unit" has cooled down, I'll plug it back
> in and report back.
 
CY: I'm guessing it will do exactly the same hum click routine.
It's late on the east coast, I'm going to bed.
======================================================================
On 7/8/2016 8:49 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> In an hour or so, when the "sealed unit" has cooled down, I'll plug it back
> in and report back.
 
As a Kenmore, you may be able to buy OEM parts, but
if it were my unit, I'd use a universal hard start
kit. Seeing as how I carry them in my vehicle and
use the universal kits at work.
======================================================================
On 7/8/2016 9:26 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> Neither would budge.
> Have you removed them before?
 
> Is there a trick to removing them?
 
To keep these parts from coming off.
 
Pull straight out from compressor. Might need to
pry with slotted screw driver. Wiggle them back
and forth while pulling.
======================================================================
On 7/8/2016 10:40 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> Is it even possible for a homeowner to replace the compressor #28?
 
No. Sorry, but that takes a lot of skills
that the average HO does not have.
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 1:27 AM, Danny D. wrote:
> b) relay, or
> c) new frig?
 
> Any idea how to test the relay?
 
d) the suggestion Stormy gave yesterday.
 
I've never tested a relay. Just replace,
and see if the unit comes back to life.
 
You may also answer my question, if you wish.
The one I asked yesterday.
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 12:29 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> http://i.cubeupload.com/ewhAUP.jpg
 
> The "courage" here is better than a shot of whiskey because you give me the
> confidence that I just need to try harder! :)
 
And, won't prevent you from being a Mormon.
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 12:49 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> On Sat, 9 Jul 2016 12:41:11 -0400, Stormin Mormon wrote:
 
>> And, won't prevent you from being a Mormon.
 
> If I become a Mormon, do I have to tell my Italian wife?
 
CY: Yes, many Italians are Mormons.
 
> Maybe I'll make a deal with her:
> Mormon for the refrigerator?
 
CY: She'll love it!
 
> PS: Is polygamy still allowed?
 
CY: Not since 1890.
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 12:47 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> it in a few times. Here is a video of what happened.
> http://tinypic.com/r/20ubk3d/9
 
> Can anyone tell, from that video, what is happening?
 
Yes. I can. Totally what I diagnosed yesterday.
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 6:50 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> He really talked me out of buying both parts. They were each about 50
> bucks, and he said I'd just be unhappy. So he sent me home to do some more
> diagnostics with a test cable, which I'm gonna make now.
 
Danny, are my posts making it through your server?
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 6:48 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> 5. Yank off the start wire as soon as the compressor starts
 
> If the compressor starts, then it's good.
> If not ...
 
Danny, are my posts making it to you,
through your server? You've not answered
my question. And you're going through a
lot of bother which isn't really needed.
 
But, did you ever do any thing simple?
 
I leave you to your complications.
======================================================================
On 7/9/2016 6:48 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> 5. Yank off the start wire as soon as the compressor starts
 
> If the compressor starts, then it's good.
> If not ...
 
Danny, are my posts making it to you, through your server?
You've not answered my question.
And you're going through a lot of bother which isn't really needed.
But, did you ever do any thing simple?
I leave you to your complications.
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 3:22 PM, Danny D. wrote:
>> piston.
 
> I don't know any other way to test for "mechanical" operation of the
> compressor.
 
Pump out all the refrigerant.
Saw the top off the compressor.
After the inspection, weld the compressor using a gas tight "bead" of weld.
Replace the refrigerant.
 
No problem for you, right?
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 5:26 PM, tom wrote:
> There are "hard start" compressor starters available that might be worth
> looking at.
 
Don't bother. I suggested that a week ago,
and Danny totally ignored me. And ignored
my hints and reminders.
 
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 7:08 PM, Bob Engelhardt wrote:
>> my hints and reminders.
 
> Actually, I don't think that you did. You probably meant to, but were
> too pissed from his ignoring you.
 
Think I remember at least one reminder. Well,
moot point. He's gone so far afield on so many
directions, there's no contacting him, now.
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 10:57 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> I think I tried *every* suggestion ever made in this thread.
 
> Here's yours, but I don't remember it being suggested until today.
> http://i.cubeupload.com/ja5XaK.jpg
 
You never answered my question, and I never
made any suggestions what to do. Other than
suggesting you answer my question so we can
move on.
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 10:47 PM, Danny D. wrote:
>> my hints and reminders.
 
> You mean this?
> http://i.cubeupload.com/VD0haS.jp
 
"not found" is what the web page says.
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 10:47 PM, Danny D. wrote:
>> my hints and reminders.
 
> You mean this?
> http://i.cubeupload.com/VD0haS.jpg
 
I added a g to the end of the URL, and got
a picture. I can't comment on that, until
you answer my question.
======================================================================
On 7/12/2016 11:21 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> How do you respond so quickly?
 
> I have to sit down at the computer to even see a message, so, I don't see
> them in real time. Do you have something that goes to your phone?
 
Coincidence. I'm on the east coast, and
spend a bit of time on the computer in
the evenings.
 
What question? I only asked twice.
======================================================================
On 7/13/2016 12:56 AM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> Is it OK to have the frig temporarily on two power cords?
> a. One for the fan and the rest of the frig
> b. One just for the compressor
 
If you'd done what I said, and played along,
this could have been fixed last week. Hope
you are enjoying your self.
 
======================================================================
On 7/13/2016 1:09 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> The 1/2-to-1/3HP hard-start cap isn't working.
 
> Half the time it starts the compressor, and half the time it does NOT start
> the compressor.
 
Yes, it's obvious that you don't see.
======================================================================
On 7/13/2016 10:00 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> I had never looked at the back of a frig in my life before.
> I ask you guys for help because the frig is a riddle to me.
> I don't need more riddles though.
 
When you run into a problem, you can either
do things differently, or force harder, using
the technique which has failed up to that point.
 
I offered you (repeatedly) a chance to do
differently, and you ignored me repeatedly.
This post is an example of trying to force
your failing techniques even harder, and
trying to force me to participate with your
failings. I'll have you know, that I viewed
NONE of the links, and barely read your text.
 
By way of references, I've been working on
domstic refrigerators for over 10 years. I'm
fairly sure that if you'd done what I said,
it would have been fixed several days ago.
I'm also fairly sure I know why your compressor
keeps going off.
======================================================================
On 7/14/2016 2:01 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> I answered *every* single question that people, including you, asked.
 
Nope. And, I asked twice.
======================================================================
On 7/14/2016 2:01 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> No more riddles please. Just straight talk.
> 1. What is your question?
> 2. What is your suggestion?
 
It's under this header, and also under
subject line of "Debug advice, and a
question for Danny D".
======================================================================
On 7/13/2016 2:02 AM, Danny D. wrote:
> I was throwing away the frig as of this morning, so, there was no need to
> clean the condenser coil. I guess I'll clean it now - although do you
> really thing *that* is what is making the compressor cycle?
 
When you go back and answer my question,
I'll consider answer yours.
======================================================================
======================================================================
"Danny D." <dannydiamico@yahoo.com>: Jul 15 01:33AM

On Wed, 13 Jul 2016 07:52:43 -0400, Stormin Mormon wrote:
 
> I'm to the point where I glance at and delete the
> posts with little attention to what he's playing
> with.
 
How can you say such a thing?
You don't seem to be seriously trying to answer the two questions I asked
you.
Bob Engelhardt <BobEngelhardt@comcast.net>: Jul 14 09:37PM -0400

Oh, for Kee-rist sake(!!) ... here is the question, in S-T's 2nd post.
Hint: it precedes the "?" punctuation:
 
On 7/8/2016 7:47 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
> If it's out of warranty, are you any good with
> electrical repairs? Please write back, and we'll
> continue the discussion.
 
Your quoting every single post of his is pointless ... nobody reads all
that!
Stormin Mormon <cayoung61@hotmail.com>: Jul 14 09:53PM -0400

On 7/14/2016 9:18 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> resistors diodes transistors, etc.. I've wired my own computers, and I've
> written assembly language programs, and I've debugged basic appliances.
 
> Having said that, I've never worked on a refrigerator before.
 
Actually, the first time I asked was without changing the subject line.
After you ignored my question (with same subject line), I changed the
subject line to make it more obvious.
 
No, I don't follow your posting pattern. I'd not even notice if you
commented on other subjects.
 
A simple answer to my question would be nice.
 
--
.
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
. www.lds.org
.
.
Stormin Mormon <cayoung61@hotmail.com>: Jul 14 09:57PM -0400

On 7/14/2016 9:22 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> I'll consider answer yours.
> ======================================================================
> ======================================================================
 
I glanced at the top third, or so, of
this lengthy overkill. You really run
on and on, you're lucky I read that much.
I saw my (yet unanswered) question three
times in the first third or so of this.
It's a simple question, and I'm looking
for a simple answer, not a lengthy rambling
on and on.
 
--
.
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
. www.lds.org
.
.
Stormin Mormon <cayoung61@hotmail.com>: Jul 14 09:58PM -0400

On 7/14/2016 9:31 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> I'll consider answer yours.
> ======================================================================
> ======================================================================
 
I saw my (very simple) question three
times. I'd sure appreciate a (very
simple) answer.
 
 
--
.
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
. www.lds.org
.
.
Stormin Mormon <cayoung61@hotmail.com>: Jul 14 09:59PM -0400

On 7/14/2016 9:33 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> How can you say such a thing?
> You don't seem to be seriously trying to answer the two questions I asked
> you.
 
I asked you a simple question.
I'm waiting.
 
--
.
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
. www.lds.org
.
.
Stormin Mormon <cayoung61@hotmail.com>: Jul 14 10:00PM -0400

On 7/14/2016 9:10 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> I'll consider answer yours.
> ======================================================================
> ======================================================================
 
I saw it three times. It was (is) a VERY
simple question, and asks for a VERY
simple answer.
 
--
.
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
. www.lds.org
.
.
Stormin Mormon <cayoung61@hotmail.com>: Jul 14 10:02PM -0400

On 7/14/2016 9:37 PM, Bob Engelhardt wrote:
>> continue the discussion.
 
> Your quoting every single post of his is pointless ... nobody reads all
> that!
 
I read about the top 1/4 to 1/3 of that text.
I saw my very simple question three times. Which
he's not answered with a very simple answer.
 
Your powers of observation are excellent. In
more than one regard.
 
--
.
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
. www.lds.org
.
.
Stormin Mormon <cayoung61@hotmail.com>: Jul 14 10:19PM -0400

On 7/14/2016 9:31 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> I have been doing this for years in this newsgroup, so you know this.
> I also do not respond to threads that I don't author, which also you should
> know by now (simply becuase I have almost never done it).
 
Since you appear to think I know all about your
posting style, I must presume that you there fore
know all about mine. I like a good trim text job.
Leave enough text so we know the question that
goes with the reply. But, sending a dozen or so
quoted replies back through the list is really bad
manners.
 
With your simple answer to my simple question,
please do a reasonable text trim. Thank you.
 
--
.
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
. www.lds.org
.
.
Stormin Mormon <cayoung61@hotmail.com>: Jul 14 10:20PM -0400

On 7/14/2016 2:01 PM, Danny D. wrote:
 
> I answered *every* single question that people, including you, asked.
 
Since you appear to think I know all about your
posting style, I must presume that you there fore
know all about mine. I like a good trim text job.
Leave enough text so we know the question that
goes with the reply. But, sending a dozen or so
quoted replies back through the list is really bad
manners.
 
With your simple answer to my simple question,
please do a reasonable text trim. Thank you.
 
 
--
.
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
. www.lds.org
.
.
Stormin Mormon <cayoung61@hotmail.com>: Jul 14 10:20PM -0400

On 7/14/2016 9:10 PM, Danny D. wrote:
> nor any question that is unanswered.
 
> Since I prove everything I say, below are the two dozen posts from you in
> this thread.
 
Since you appear to think I know all about your
posting style, I must presume that you there fore
know all about mine. I like a good trim text job.
Leave enough text so we know the question that
goes with the reply. But, sending a dozen or so
quoted replies back through the list is really bad
manners.
 
With your simple answer to my simple question,
please do a reasonable text trim. Thank you.
 
 
--
.
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
. www.lds.org
.
.
Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com>: Jul 14 06:43PM -0700

On Thu, 14 Jul 2016 18:45:05 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
>9.3mA. The bench PSU doesn't have any issues powering this board.
 
>When connected to PSU that uses the LM317, however, it draws 3mA and the
>voltage across it drops to around 6V.
 
Average or peak currents? Better yet, put a resistor in series and
look at the current waveform on a differential scope (using 2 probes).
I would not be surprised to see the LM317 oscillating at some fairly
high frequency. If so, you need a BFC (big fat capacitor).
 
--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com>: Jul 14 06:53PM -0700

On Thu, 14 Jul 2016 18:47:03 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
 
>Don't see how that's possible, Jeff, since it's still happy to supply
>passive loads that are much heavier, and at a rock solid stable output
>voltage.
 
I can't argue with that, except that several people and the data sheet
have mentioned that the LM317T doesn't like light loads and has a
minimum load current specification. Since this is your problem, not
mine, I can only offer suggestions and things to try. Since your
regulator doesn't like a light load, kindly put a load resistor across
the 12V line and see if the situation improves. (Hint: When
troubleshooting, I like to do easy things first. A resistor is easy).
 
Incidentally, it is possible to damage an IC to the point where it
still functions, but no in the manner commonly expected. I've done
this numerous times with RF power transistors, where there are a bunch
of transistor in parallel inside the packages. The LM317T probably
doesn't have this exact problem, but might not appreciate having some
holes blown in the IC's insulating layers. It's not easy to test for
this, so just replace the LM317T with one that has a good chance of
working.
 
I'm also wondering if there's something odd about your construction
methods. I've seen 3 terminal regulators work well on a PCB
breadboard with good grounding, and then go nuts when laid out on a
PCB, where the ground follows a long and twisted path to the
regulator. A big electrolytic on the output helps, but only if the
leads and traces are fairly short. If you built your regulator on one
of those solderless breadboard abominations,
<https://www.google.com/search?q=solderless+breadboard&tbm=isch>
then I suggest you find a piece of PCB material and build it better.
Then give the solderless breadboard to your worst enemy.
 
As for the 555, it allegedly draws very little current, but it doesn't
hurt to check. Insert a 1 ohm resistor in the PS line and measure the
drain with a differential input scope (i.e. using 2 scope probes).
Look for giant current spikes and high freq oscillations, that don't
belong.
 
 
--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com>: Jul 14 07:04PM -0700

On Thu, 14 Jul 2016 18:47:03 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
 
>Don't see how that's possible, Jeff, since it's still happy to supply
>passive loads that are much heavier, and at a rock solid stable output
>voltage.
 
Here's another way to blow up an LM317 using nearly maximum voltage
ratings:
<http://electronics.stackexchange.com/questions/148340/how-to-protect-lm317-from-output-short>
Just short the input or output to ground and the filter caps will
discharge through the LM317.
 
 
--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
M Philbrook <jamie_ka1lpa@charter.net>: Jul 14 07:01PM -0400

In article <nm7ifs$7mj$1@dont-email.me>, diverse@tcp.co.uk says...
 
> I would get inside and clean any range/function switch contacts.
> Does the manual advice against use near loudspeakers, laying meter jaws
> next to screwdrivers etc
 
this meter is only a few days old in my hands, there should be no crud
in there.

The manual only says to remove test leads when using the clamp and
there is an obvious reason for that, to prevent the leads getting into
the equipment while reaching in. The leads were still in the package.
 
I will try a demagnetizer/degaussing process
 
Jamie
JW <none@dev.null>: Jul 14 06:58PM -0400

On Thu, 14 Jul 2016 19:01:41 -0400 M Philbrook <jamie_ka1lpa@charter.net>
wrote in Message id:
>there is an obvious reason for that, to prevent the leads getting into
>the equipment while reaching in. The leads were still in the package.
 
> I will try a demagnetizer/degaussing process
 
Or get a Fluke. Odd things like this is why I won't touch B brands...
I need to trust my gear and not fuck around with crap.
M Philbrook <jamie_ka1lpa@charter.net>: Jul 14 07:20PM -0400

In article <366gob9ormtvoev7c4l4j60f9aviun8l02@4ax.com>, none@dev.null
says...
 
> > I will try a demagnetizer/degaussing process
 
> Or get a Fluke. Odd things like this is why I won't touch B brands...
> I need to trust my gear and not fuck around with crap.
 
Ok, we have flukes there too, they fail just as bad ;)
 
Jamie
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