sci.electronics.repair - 25 new messages in 12 topics - digest

sci.electronics.repair
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair?hl=en

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Today's topics:

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Roland XP 60 , 5 octave keyboard , 1997
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/3078908fbe1e3ff8?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Thurs, Dec 2 2010 12:37 am
From: "N_Cook"

Michael A. Terrell <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:cL6dnb59ZJzykmrRnZ2dnUVZ_j-dnZ2d@earthlink.com...
>
> Mike wrote:
> >
> > In article <pan.2010.11.30.14.37.03@lmao.lol.lol>,
> > Meat Plow <mhywatt@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> > >that a standard 34 pin floppy would
> > >interchange regardless of the unit.
> >
> > In the early days of floppy interfaces, before PCs style drives became
"the
> > standard", there were many annoying little variations that could stop a
> > floppy drive working when swapped about. Much of that persists in
non-standard
> > drives used on things like keyboards. Why should they strive for
compatibility
> > with PCs when we can avoid it and charge extra for a "special" drive?
> >
> > It used to be that a floppy drive had multiple jumper sets (0.1") that
could
> > be strapped to configure them, often to do with things like the logic
around
> > which Drive Select (0,1,2,3) and whether the "motor enable" line would
be
> > used. Some host systems didn't assert motor enable, so the drive would
be
> > jumpered to run off JUST the drive select.
> >
> > It was PCs, I think, that introduced the idea of no jumpers, no drive
select,
> > just put a twist in the cable, which limited you to 2 "identical"
drives. The
> > proper floppy spec allowed for 4, but each drive was jumpered
differently, and
> > connected totally in parallel.
>
>
> In the XT and early AT days the floppy controller boards could handle
> two sets of two drives. Some controllers could be set to one of four
> addresses for a maximum of 16 floppy drives on one computer.
>
>
> > This is before you get into weird drives that ran at 300 vs 600rpm and
> > that sort of thing, where to use them with a PC, some components needed
to be
> > changed to re-set the rotation speed and frequency response to the data
being
> > read back.
> >
> > --
>
> --------------------------------------+-----------------------------------
-
> > Mike Brown: mjb[-at-]signal11.org.uk | http://www.signal11.org.uk
>
>
> --
> For the last time: I am not a mad scientist, I'm just a very ticked off
> scientist!!!

I did notice 3 or 4 submin 2 or 3 way slide switches inside that Roland
Panasonic FDD, gives a goodly number of permutations

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Thurs, Dec 2 2010 10:05 am
From: Jeff Liebermann

On Sun, 28 Nov 2010 14:11:54 -0000, "N_Cook" <diverse@tcp.co.uk>
wrote:

>In for a power supply fault but while in there, the floppy drive has never
>worked. Would it be a standard PC drive? or known simple repairable stock
>fault? It does klunk once, on pwering up , sort of PC fashion

I just destroyed a Roland D-5 keyboard. What a piece of unrepairable
junk. Hopefully, the XP-60 is better built. I could not determine if
the XP-60 media uses 1.44MB or 720KB floppish. What is the make and
muddle drive that is stock for the Roland XP-60?
<http://www.vintagesynth.com/roland/xp60.php>

I recently repaired a Korg DSS-1 with the traditional dead floppy disk
drive problem.
<http://802.11junk.com/jeffl/Korg_DSS-1/>
If your XP60 requires a 720KB floppy drive, instead of the usual
1.44MByte floppy drive, you have to find one that has suitable jumpers
available. This might also help:
<http://blog.retrosynth.com/archives/2005/08/fun_with_akai_m.html>
If you're lucky, the only jumper you'll need to move is the drive
select jumper, usually labeled DS0, DS1, DS2, and DS3. The common PC
drive is set to DS1. Most of the synthesizers I've played with use
DS0.

Oddly, all of the five or so synthesizers I've fixed that had floppy
drives have all had dead floppy disk drives. My guess(tm) is that
they die from static discharge while shoving the floppy into the
drive. That's what killed mine. I've thought of electroplating the
plastic front panel of the drive with metallic chrome or other metal,
to discharge the static before the floppy enters the drive.

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

==============================================================================
TOPIC: RAC Portable Power Station, need DC adaptor spec
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/b105b15b5ad9d933?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 8 ==
Date: Thurs, Dec 2 2010 2:01 am
From: Adrian C

http://i912.photobucket.com/albums/ac327/turnstyler/IMG_3573.jpg

A neighbour has dropped in with his discharged and dead "RAC Portable
Power Station and Engine Starter" which he obtained without the
necessary DC charger. The starter is a dayglo orange heavy thing with a
handle and says it can crank 400 Amps.

Anyway, written on the front of the DC input socket, it claims it needs
16V - so I've got it charging up of one of my laboratory supplies set at
that.

Initially connecting it up, it was was drawing about 100mA. After 5
hours it's now drawing 400mA. Must have some 'inteligence' in it.

So I'd guess a 16V 500mA adaptor (or thereabouts) would be a suitable
replacement. But to check if anyone has one of these, could ye check
what's written on the mains adaptor? And can find for reference the user
instructions?

Thanks.

--
Adrian C

== 2 of 8 ==
Date: Thurs, Dec 2 2010 2:53 am
From: "Dave Plowman (News)"

In article <8lp941F9unU1@mid.individual.net>,
Adrian C <email@here.invalid> wrote:
> Anyway, written on the front of the DC input socket, it claims it needs
> 16V - so I've got it charging up of one of my laboratory supplies set at
> that.

> Initially connecting it up, it was was drawing about 100mA. After 5
> hours it's now drawing 400mA. Must have some 'inteligence' in it.

If the internal lead acid battery was very flat, this is what happens. The
internal resistance goes high. As it charges, it comes down to where it
should be. FWIW the SLAs used on these won't supply starting current very
often. Perhaps a half dozen times or so before they no longer manage the
full amount. But can limp on as just a portable 12v DC supply for quite
some time.

> So I'd guess a 16V 500mA adaptor (or thereabouts) would be a suitable
> replacement. But to check if anyone has one of these, could ye check
> what's written on the mains adaptor? And can find for reference the user
> instructions?

My Lidl one has a 1000 mA wall wart. I can look at its spec if you want.

--
*I'm pretty sure that sex is better than logic, but I can't prove it.

Dave Plowman dave@davenoise.co.uk London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

== 3 of 8 ==
Date: Thurs, Dec 2 2010 7:55 am
From: Harry Bloomfield

Adrian C expressed precisely :
> Initially connecting it up, it was was drawing about 100mA. After 5 hours
> it's now drawing 400mA. Must have some 'inteligence' in it.

That is the usual behaviour of a completely flat lead acid battery,
rather than any built in intelligence. My (not RAC) unit has an
automatic charger built in, which cuts it off once the fully charged
voltage is reached, but yours might not do that (look for an LED marked
charged)- so it might need to be carefully matched in voltage output.
It lights up as soon as powered, then goes out once fully charged and
stays out until powed down and up again.

It's charger suggests it is 18v 0.75amp DC. If yours lacks the charge
control built in, you need a voltage controlled PSU of around 13.8 to
14.2v.

--
Regards,
Harry (M1BYT) (L)
http://www.ukradioamateur.co.uk

== 4 of 8 ==
Date: Thurs, Dec 2 2010 9:44 am
From: "Dave Plowman (News)"

In article <517f4550a8dave@davenoise.co.uk>,
Dave Plowman (News) <dave@davenoise.co.uk> wrote:
> > So I'd guess a 16V 500mA adaptor (or thereabouts) would be a suitable
> > replacement. But to check if anyone has one of these, could ye check
> > what's written on the mains adaptor? And can find for reference the
> > user instructions?

> My Lidl one has a 1000 mA wall wart. I can look at its spec if you want.

It's actually marked 12 volt DC 1000mA. So must be a very nominal 12
volts. ;-)

--
*The longest recorded flightof a chicken is thirteen seconds *

Dave Plowman dave@davenoise.co.uk London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

== 5 of 8 ==
Date: Thurs, Dec 2 2010 10:41 am
From: Adrian C

On 02/12/2010 17:44, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
> In article<517f4550a8dave@davenoise.co.uk>,
> Dave Plowman (News)<dave@davenoise.co.uk> wrote:
>>> So I'd guess a 16V 500mA adaptor (or thereabouts) would be a suitable
>>> replacement. But to check if anyone has one of these, could ye check
>>> what's written on the mains adaptor? And can find for reference the
>>> user instructions?
>
>> My Lidl one has a 1000 mA wall wart. I can look at its spec if you want.
>
> It's actually marked 12 volt DC 1000mA. So must be a very nominal 12
> volts. ;-)
>

Thanks for checking.

Something unregulated rated at anything past 12V rated at an amp or more
might just fit the task, and be easier to find in the junk pile than
something unregulated and small with specifically 16V stamped on it.

He'll go for that :-)

--
Adrian C

== 6 of 8 ==
Date: Thurs, Dec 2 2010 10:52 am
From: Harry Bloomfield

Adrian C has brought this to us :
> Thanks for checking.
>
> Something unregulated rated at anything past 12V rated at an amp or more
> might just fit the task, and be easier to find in the junk pile than
> something unregulated and small with specifically 16V stamped on it.

12v or even 13.5v will not put a charge into a 12v lead acid battery,
it needs to be in the range 13.8 to 14.2v

--
Regards,
Harry (M1BYT) (L)
http://www.ukradioamateur.co.uk

== 7 of 8 ==
Date: Thurs, Dec 2 2010 10:53 am
From: Terry Fields

Adrian C wrote:

>
>http://i912.photobucket.com/albums/ac327/turnstyler/IMG_3573.jpg
>
>A neighbour has dropped in with his discharged and dead "RAC Portable
>Power Station and Engine Starter" which he obtained without the
>necessary DC charger. The starter is a dayglo orange heavy thing with a
>handle and says it can crank 400 Amps.
>
>Anyway, written on the front of the DC input socket, it claims it needs
>16V - so I've got it charging up of one of my laboratory supplies set at
>that.
>
>Initially connecting it up, it was was drawing about 100mA. After 5
>hours it's now drawing 400mA. Must have some 'inteligence' in it.
>
>So I'd guess a 16V 500mA adaptor (or thereabouts) would be a suitable
>replacement. But to check if anyone has one of these, could ye check
>what's written on the mains adaptor? And can find for reference the user
>instructions?
>
>Thanks.

These days battery chargers are very sophisticated things in how they
treat batteries. If your friend has more than one battery to care for,
an Optimate or Accumate charger might be a good idea, but they aren't
cheap.

== 8 of 8 ==
Date: Thurs, Dec 2 2010 11:06 am
From: Adrian C

On 02/12/2010 18:52, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
> Adrian C has brought this to us :
>> Thanks for checking.
>>
>> Something unregulated rated at anything past 12V rated at an amp or
>> more might just fit the task, and be easier to find in the junk pile
>> than something unregulated and small with specifically 16V stamped on it.
>
> 12v or even 13.5v will not put a charge into a 12v lead acid battery, it
> needs to be in the range 13.8 to 14.2v
>

A biggish transformer marked 12v lightly loaded will be supplying that
and more easily. Got no worries about that (and as I said easier for me
to find).

Cheers

--
Adrian

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Tripp Lite PR60 power supply problem
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/7dfcf0c7725c59ff?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Thurs, Dec 2 2010 2:03 am
From: JW

On Wed, 1 Dec 2010 13:28:11 -0800 (PST) klem kedidelhopper
<captainvideo462009@gmail.com> wrote in Message id:
<391adb92-6aa5-4951-be64-b2bffa588084@j21g2000vba.googlegroups.com>:

>Yeah I don't think that its a zener either. Its just that with the
>cathode on + it doesn't seem like it could be forward biased so what
>is it doing there?

Reverse voltage protection for the cap?

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Spyware removal
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/8371970c72652e9a?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Thurs, Dec 2 2010 3:18 am
From: Bob Villa

On Dec 1, 11:48 pm, "larry moe 'n curly" <larrymoencu...@my-deja.com>
wrote:
> klem kedidelhopper wrote:
>
> > Is there a spyware removal program, (preferably a free one), available
> > to download that I can trust that won't just load more crap onto my
> > poor suffering machine?
>
> It seems SuperAntiSpyware is among the most thorough: www.SuperAntiSpyware.com
>
> Malware Bytes sometimes helps when nothing else works: www.malwarebytes.org
>
> The free versions of the above two programs have to be run manually,
> but the free versions of the programs below are meant to provide full-
> time protection, although such protection often lets malware through,
> and apparently occasional manual scans should be done with any
> security program:
>
> Microsoft's own Security Essentials is good: www.microsoft.com/security_essentials/
>
> There's Avast!, which a lot of people like: www.avast.com
>
> Avira has done well in some tests: www.avira.com
>
> Probably the most popular free antivirus is AVG: www.free.avg.com
>
> If you're running Windows 98, trywww.OldVersion.comfor older
> versions of programs. I used AVG ver. 7.x with 98SE, and last year
> the virus definitions were still being updated, but 8.x refused to
> work with 98SE, even though 7.x kept telling me to upgrade to it.

Maybe you could sign your posting...so we know who to credit?
(larry,moe, or curly)

==============================================================================
TOPIC: CINEMA ACTRESS HOT VIDEOS HERE
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/15c72e99010494da?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Thurs, Dec 2 2010 5:03 am
From: cinema

http://wwwcinemaulagam.org

http://www.cinemaulagam.org

==============================================================================
TOPIC: http://123maza.com/35/purpose854/
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/9f78f223c02da22b?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Thurs, Dec 2 2010 6:13 am
From: Jeffrey Angus

On 12/2/2010 1:56 AM, Sivakumar durai wrote:
> Money making company

Oh? So what, you sell printing presses?

Jeff

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Thurs, Dec 2 2010 7:15 am
From: "Michael A. Terrell"

Jeffrey Angus wrote:
>
> On 12/2/2010 1:56 AM, Sivakumar durai wrote:
> > Money making company
>
> Oh? So what, you sell printing presses?
>
> Jeff

No, he spams a lot of groups, promising different things just to get
hits on that website.

--
For the last time: I am not a mad scientist, I'm just a very ticked off
scientist!!!

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Emachines Motherboard Failure Loss Of Onboard Video No Startup T3410
Desktop PC
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/89c065f832dd79ec?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 2 ==
Date: Thurs, Dec 2 2010 6:32 am
From: mike

Wild_Bill wrote:
> A friend's Emachine T3410 began displaying incorrect/odd colors and then the
> video output stopped. He didn't mention the "funny colors" to me, only that
> it had happened, and that now there was no video.
>
> After substituting a known good PSU in the machine (with the HDD and DVD
> disconnected), I've concluded that the onboard CPU supply is bad or another
> mainboard fault, and that the (maybe 4.5 year old) machine should be
> replaced.
> I did advise my friend that a new m-bd and CPU combo could be bought for
> about $60, so it's up to him.
>
Hey WB -

if it were mine, before giving up on it (either the old or the new
board) I'd try loading the
both the chipset driver and the vga driver packages that they have on
the Emachines support site, from the dates listed, they're both much
newer than the MB - if you already tried that, nevermind...

Good luck,

Mike

== 2 of 2 ==
Date: Thurs, Dec 2 2010 11:51 am
From: "Wild_Bill"

I wouldn't think these steps would be possible with the failed m-bd since
there was no POST or video output, or access to BIOS setup.

The new board is operating as it should, but I didn't check to see if the
drivers and BIOS are the newest versions shown on the Emachine support site.
The BIOS version shows up briefly after/during POST on older machines, but I
didn't look for it after the new board was installed.

The old CPU or the m-bd have failed, most likely.. and if I were willing to
throw more money into it, I could first replace some electrolytic caps that
have suspiciously high ESR (small 100uF several of 'em, and a couple of
others), or buy a new CPU.

The larger value caps for the CPU voltages appear to be connected in
parallel, so the in-circuit ESR readings aren't reliable. Desoldering them
for testing isn't a big deal, but the board is old and wasn't a high grade
board when new.

--
Cheers,
WB
.............

"mike" <mlightner@survivormail.com> wrote in message
news:0b80a529-d2a7-4e30-9943-4c65961a583c@35g2000prt.googlegroups.com...
>
>
> Wild_Bill wrote:
>> A friend's Emachine T3410 began displaying incorrect/odd colors and then
>> the
>> video output stopped. He didn't mention the "funny colors" to me, only
>> that
>> it had happened, and that now there was no video.
>>
>> After substituting a known good PSU in the machine (with the HDD and DVD
>> disconnected), I've concluded that the onboard CPU supply is bad or
>> another
>> mainboard fault, and that the (maybe 4.5 year old) machine should be
>> replaced.
>> I did advise my friend that a new m-bd and CPU combo could be bought for
>> about $60, so it's up to him.
>>
> Hey WB -
>
> if it were mine, before giving up on it (either the old or the new
> board) I'd try loading the
> both the chipset driver and the vga driver packages that they have on
> the Emachines support site, from the dates listed, they're both much
> newer than the MB - if you already tried that, nevermind...
>
> Good luck,
>
> Mike

==============================================================================
TOPIC: HS-U580 Mitsubishi RF output issue
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/1b13fb4c0caeca33?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Thurs, Dec 2 2010 7:29 am
From: Bruce Esquibel

bob u <sound@inetnebr.com> wrote:

> yes, its blue with no audio on both VCR tuner and VCR tape.
> But they both work on the Video line output jacks.

You said earlier, "This does not sound like a modulator issue", but it seems
to be one to me. I'm not familar with that model but many vcr's get the
audio/video feed into the modulator from the a/v jacks, or the same path.

So generally if you have composite working but no r/f, it's something with
the modulator.

Also, are you sure the vcr is the one producing the blue screen? Most tv's
within the last couple decades go to blue screen if no rf signal is present
on a channel.

If the modulator is dead, or not getting power, would make sense with the
blue screen.

Generally modulators have a switched 5 or 12 volts fed to them when "on".

Usually only 5 or 6 pins.

Without a schematic, I'd just use a volt meter, touch each pin while
switching it from "tv" to "vcr" mode, one of them should swing from
next-to-nothing to +5 or +12.

If none do, it's in the switch circuit (schematic needed at this point), if
one pin does, it's probably the modulator. Would only take a few seconds at
this point with a scope to see if video and audio is present at the other
pins.

Basically, if you have power, video and audio going into the modulator and
nothing out, it's a bad modulator.

My guess is, if it was working and stopped working after a couple weeks with
the new owner, likely there is something he isn't telling you.

Many "bad" modulators went bad right after the owner tried to do something,
forced a cable in, bent pin, yanked the cable hard.

Many a modulator gets the center of the "out" jack cracked or broken off the
circuit board inside of it. Too little pad for too big of a connection. Any
abnormal force breaks it.

The hardest part to all of this is just gaining access to the modulator,
some are a peice of cake, some a pain in the ass.

But I'd still guess "something happend" when "it just quit working".

-bruce
bje@ripco.com

==============================================================================
TOPIC: looking for DAQ that measures PPM tia sal22
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/8f7517bc0bc14e6f?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Thurs, Dec 2 2010 7:36 am
From: ratullloch_delthis

Greetings all

I'm looking for a DAQ that will measure PPM (particles per million) over time, can anyone recomend one?

tial sal22

==============================================================================
TOPIC: cheap wholesale Burberry sunglasses（www.nike-black.com ）
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/4c576212827acf0b?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Thurs, Dec 2 2010 8:13 am
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==============================================================================
TOPIC: Simple hack To Get $7999 To Your Paypal
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/806a10c1bd804299?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 1 ==
Date: Thurs, Dec 2 2010 9:28 am
From: SUHASINI

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Due to High Security Risk I have Hidden the Videos
In an Image In that Website On Right Side Below Search Box
Click On Image And Watch Videos

==============================================================================
TOPIC: Batteries That Do Not Leak w/Age?
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.electronics.repair/t/fd55784ea36aafe5?hl=en
==============================================================================

== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Dec 2 2010 11:56 am
From: David Nebenzahl

On 12/1/2010 12:39 PM Jeff Liebermann spake thus:

> On Wed, 01 Dec 2010 13:55:39 -0500, "Michael A. Terrell"
> <mike.terrell@earthlink.net> wrote:
>
>>> So why do you get *something* while I get *nothing*? Null. Nada. Zip.
>
>> Have you cleared your catche?

Yes. Did nothing. (I did use ipconfig, which did flush the cache, but it
made no difference.)

So today I tried something: loading the page in IE. (That shows you just
how loathe I am to use that POS.) It loaded the page. Sort of.

I think this comes down to a "purity" issue. Let me explain.

IE did load something, but I'd hardly call it a useable web page. As the
status indicator at lower left so succinctly puts it, it was "Done, but
with errors on page". I believe these errors are on the part of the site
owners, but of course I can't be sure.

As rendered by IE, there's a *huge* expanse of blank blue space above
the page, and the page is badly formatted, with the forum list sqoze
into a narrow column on the left side.

So what I *think* happens with Firefox is that it detects errors, and
then, in the infinite wisdom of its geekish authors, simply refuses to
go any further, resulting in a COMPLETELY BLANK PAGE. (I've objected to
this behavior for years, arguing that in an imperfect world full of
imperfect and non-compliant web coding that it's better to render
*something* than to put one's nose in the air, metaphorically speaking,
and refuse to render *anything*--or at least leave this option up to the
user--but no, the geeks insist on purity here, damn the real-world
consequences.)

So bottom line is that with the software I have, including a pretty
up-to-date version of FF, I cannot view this page.

If you care to diagnose further:

W2K, SP 4
Sygate firewall
Dial-up access
No proxies, spyware (that I know of), virii, etc.

--
The fashion in killing has an insouciant, flirty style this spring,
with the flaunting of well-defined muscle, wrapped in flags.

- Comment from an article on Antiwar.com (http://antiwar.com)

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Dec 2 2010 12:12 pm
From: David Nebenzahl

On 12/1/2010 12:34 PM Jeff Liebermann spake thus:

> On Wed, 01 Dec 2010 10:37:38 -0800, David Nebenzahl
> <nobody@but.us.chickens> wrote:
>
>> So why do you get *something* while I get *nothing*? Null. Nada.
>> Zip. (Using an otherwise apparently well-working copy of Firefox
>> (3.6.8).)
>
> You might want to double check the version again. Although Firefox is
> almost up to date (3.6.12 is current), your Thunderbird, that you're
> using to post messages, is far out of date:
> User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.4 (Windows/20070604)
> Current is 3.1.6. You'll need to download a fresh copy as update
> doesn't alway work between major version changes.

I have to say--and this is a little off-topic, I realize--that with all
due respect to your astute observations of my software revision levels,
I have no intention of upgrading my copy of Thunderbird. And this is
deliberate on my part.

Why? Because upgrading Firefox, my web browser, is one thing. If it
fucks up, all I lose is, basically, nothing (I keep my bookmarks backed
up well enough). But if the Tbird install goes haywire, I stand to lose
a lot: my previous email messages, address book, not to mention
newsgroup stuff. Oh, I wouldn't actually *lose* it: I know where the
inboxes and such reside, and can save and restore them, but it's a PAIN
IN THE ASS that I wish to avoid.

I've had enough bad luck with this geek-produced software that I'm quite
gun shy about upgrading. And while there are plenty of annoying things
about Thunderbird (like why, on my machine with not a lot of RAM, it
exhibits the most piss-poor memory management I've seen of ANY
application EVER, resulting in occasional "naps" of up to a minute while
it scrambles to purge and reallocate memory), it's a case of better the
devil you know; I'm not interested in discovering all those NEW bugs
they've introduced after fixing the old ones.

So thanks, but no thanks.

We now return to our regularly scheduled programming.

--
The fashion in killing has an insouciant, flirty style this spring,
with the flaunting of well-defined muscle, wrapped in flags.

- Comment from an article on Antiwar.com (http://antiwar.com)

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Dec 2 2010 12:13 pm
From: Jeff Liebermann

On Thu, 02 Dec 2010 11:56:32 -0800, David Nebenzahl
<nobody@but.us.chickens> wrote:

>So bottom line is that with the software I have, including a pretty
>up-to-date version of FF, I cannot view this page.

Try again. It seems to be back up this morning.
<http://www.candlepowerforums.com>
Hmmm... still has problems. It wants me to register/login before I
can use the search box. I don't think it did that before the upgrade.

--
Jeff Liebermann jeffl@cruzio.com
150 Felker St #D http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Thurs, Dec 2 2010 12:23 pm
From: David Nebenzahl

On 12/2/2010 12:13 PM Jeff Liebermann spake thus:

> On Thu, 02 Dec 2010 11:56:32 -0800, David Nebenzahl
> <nobody@but.us.chickens> wrote:
>
>> So bottom line is that with the software I have, including a pretty
>> up-to-date version of FF, I cannot view this page.
>
> Try again. It seems to be back up this morning.
> <http://www.candlepowerforums.com>
> Hmmm... still has problems. It wants me to register/login before I
> can use the search box. I don't think it did that before the upgrade.

Judging from the number of error messages that IE (5) reports when
loading that page, there are some serious problems on the sending side
of that site. I don't think it's our software.

Too bad; the content over there is intriguing.

(By the way, the URL that eventually loads is
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/portal/index.php. Is that correct?)

--
The fashion in killing has an insouciant, flirty style this spring,
with the flaunting of well-defined muscle, wrapped in flags.

- Comment from an article on Antiwar.com (http://antiwar.com)

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